RT-P models- Should I consider one?

[jeffg47]

I bought a K1200GT this summer and have been in love with it except for the ergonomics of the bike for longer rides. I also have an H-D Electra Glide which is like a lounge chair on wheels.(slow and noisy in comparison). Anyhow I'm intrigued with an RT model and can't justify spending too much for another bike. I see Police models on e-bay that seem affordable but I don't know enough about the differences in the rt vs. the rt-p model. Anyone out there with experience or advice? Are these used Police bikes trashed by the time they're retired?

Thanks,

Jeff

[Woodie]

RT-P's: YMMV. In a big way.

 

My experience has been mostly positive. 1100 purchased from dealer after 60K miles with the CHP. Reconditioned by BMW NA, stripped of most of the special stuff.

 

Differences between the RT and the RTP

-P has a bigger alternator

-P has a 2nd battery option

-P may have a radio box instead of a passenger seat

-P has crash-bars on it

-P has a slightly lower top speed, but is "sportier"? (final drive ratio a bit lower than the civilian model)

-P has a slightly different wiring harness

-P has special shielded ($$$) plug wires

 

The frame/engine/brakes/heated grips/windshield/seat/handlebars/ABS are all the same on both models.

 

[Dave_C]

The police agencies have all the regular maintenance done. Those cops do ride them pretty hard. No passenger seat and often the skinny "city" bags.

[cali_beemer]

I would have normally said no, without question. The RT-P's get ridden hard and often by guys that dont know how to ride them in the first place. I have heard some of the stories by mechanics that work on them. My recent new motorcycle purchase within the last week, I was on a very tight budget of 6k. I found a 2004 dual spark RT-P that only had 17k miles, so I figured I would go to look at it. It was advertised as never being dropped or laid down and imaculate condition. The bike hade been laid down hard on both sides when I got there. The cylinder heads were shaved flat. My feeling is if they are low mileage, they were retired for a reason. If they are high mileage they have typically been abused hard. Most people I have met with them have had a host of repairs to make after purchase. If you are your own mechanic then they can be a good deal I suppose but around here re-sale value is very weak on them. Theres a bunch of funky crash bars to come off to have any good looks and less weight, the rear fender ends up with a cutout if you do it. Alot have holes in the dash from removal of equipment. As noted they are single seating only, they have narrow case lids so dont expect to hold much. The swap to a dual seat is around 500 through a dealer if I remeber but I suppose it can be cheaper through beemerboneyard. Overall, after thinking about it, I passed and I still stick to my original idea that these really areant that good of an idea. If you dont do your own repairs I wouldnt even consider one at all. In my case I can do most repairs. I just bought my used 02 K1200RS for 6k (the same as the RTP), less miles, more bike in my opinion, electronic cruise control and about 1k dollars in extras. It was a much better purchase IMO.

[r77toy]

RTP's are serviced by the dealer, not the city fleet, you can take the VIN to a dealer and get the service records.

[Woodie]

The RT-P's get ridden hard and often by guys that dont know how to ride them in the first place.

I think this statement is pure BS. Average Motor officers get far more training than average civilian riders.

 

My feeling is if they are low mileage, they were retired for a reason. If they are high mileage they have typically been abused hard. Most people I have met with them have had a host of repairs to make after purchase.

I tend to agree about low mileage ones, although it depends on which department owned it, and how it was used. High mileage, that's just your opinion. Many have required work, many have not. Most of the CHP 1100's were retired at 60K under the (then) contract--not necessarily abused, let alone hard. CHP 1150's were kept well past the 60K miles, due to problems with the next CHP contract. Obviously, with more miles, more things to go wrong.

 

around here re-sale value is very weak on them.

Agreed - but in CA, they're so common, prices are weaker.

 

Theres a bunch of funky crash bars to come off to have any good looks

Funky? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think they look good with the crash bars, still better than the 1200s!

 

Alot have holes in the dash from removal of equipment.

Other than the cutouts along the existing vent, no holes in my dash. I leave the light-mounts there - no hole.

 

As noted they are single seating only, they have narrow case lids so dont expect to hold much.

Take off the narrow case lids, and put on the standard ones. I did it for <$80.

[cali_beemer]

The RT-P's get ridden hard and often by guys that dont know how to ride them in the first place.

I think this statement is pure BS. Average Motor officers get far more training than average civilian riders.

 

My feeling is if they are low mileage, they were retired for a reason. If they are high mileage they have typically been abused hard. Most people I have met with them have had a host of repairs to make after purchase.

I tend to agree about low mileage ones, although it depends on which department owned it, and how it was used. High mileage, that's just your opinion. Many have required work, many have not. Most of the CHP 1100's were retired at 60K under the (then) contract--not necessarily abused, let alone hard. CHP 1150's were kept well past the 60K miles, due to problems with the next CHP contract. Obviously, with more miles, more things to go wrong.

 

around here re-sale value is very weak on them.

Agreed - but in CA, they're so common, prices are weaker.

 

Theres a bunch of funky crash bars to come off to have any good looks

Funky? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think they look good with the crash bars, still better than the 1200s!

 

Alot have holes in the dash from removal of equipment.

Other than the cutouts along the existing vent, no holes in my dash. I leave the light-mounts there - no hole.

 

As noted they are single seating only, they have narrow case lids so dont expect to hold much.

Take off the narrow case lids, and put on the standard ones. I did it for <$80.

 

I tend to disagree on how they ride. Yes they do get alot of training but there are still alot of ego-crazy, cop riders. Some that just try to muscle things rather than use finess. Most dont give a crap about the bike becasue its completly covered. However, on the plus side you do know it has been dealer serviced, repaired and maintained. I do still question the condition when they retire. Most RT-P owners I know have had alot of stuff wrong within a short mileage after purchase with the tranny being a very common item.

 

Yes, in california, the resale value is even lower as they are very abundant. The holes on the dash vary depending on equipment installed. The one I just looked at had alot of holes in the dash around 3-4 round holes as well as a large rectangular cutout. You can find these now from local PD departments, CHP, sherriff, funeral procession, etc.... unfortunaltey they often dont tell you which agency.

 

Yes you can do things like change the lids for the cases but to me, you add up all the things to change to make it look like a civilian version, you might as well just bought the civilian version (and not have to deal with the hanus black and white paint). I am familiar with the mandatory buyout at 60k on early models but I have seen some spectacular deals on high mileage R1100RT civilian bikes. I guess I just dont see the value in these like some. However, I do appreciate some of the upgrades on the RT-P. The crash bars that you may find pretty, seem very heavy and would detreact from the handling prowess the RT offers.

 

I still think the only way I would consider one is if I were a single rider that could perform mechanical work and wasnt concerned about resale value. I had started to consider one but as noted, getting up close I wont anymore. I am sure they can be great bikes but with some attention. In my case I can paint the bike and I have access to powdercoating cheap and I still passed.

[XTrooper]

I tend to disagree on how they ride. Yes they do get alot of training but there are still alot of ego-crazy, cop riders. Some that just try to muscle things rather than use finess.

 

And you know this how? Were you involved in a study of the psyche of police motor officers or are you, as seems obvious to me, taking your preconceived ideas and prejudices and presenting them as fact?

 

The truth of the matter is, the vast majority of motor officers are proud professionals who damn well know how to ride and who don't, as a rule, abuse their equipment. That's a fact founded on knowledge and experience, not baseless conjecture.

[BailyD]

The absolute best way to know is if you know where it came from. If you know who was riding it you could get a good history. My 07 has 18,000 miles on it and I never abuse it. I do have to run it up to catch people and go code to a call but I'm always mindful of "my" bike. I do not share it and it comes home with me every night. My wife complains that I clean and wax it more than my own cars, while off duty!

 

It would be hard with such a big place like the CHP, but if you could find one coming out of a local PD maybe you could speak with the Motor Ofcs. I bet they would tell you. I mentioned it before that my Partner's bike is GORGEOUS!!!!

[upflying]

I tend to disagree on how they ride. Yes they do get alot of training but there are still alot of ego-crazy, cop riders. Some that just try to muscle things rather than use finess.

 

And you know this how? Were you involved in a study of the psyche of police motor officers or are you, as seems obvious to me, taking your preconceived ideas and prejudices and presenting them as fact?

 

The truth of the matter is, the vast majority of motor officers are proud professionals who damn well know how to ride and who don't, as a rule, abuse their equipment. That's a fact founded on knowledge and experience, not baseless conjecture.

X2, this discussion board seems to be overly sensitive and politically correct when members bring up stereotyping. But when it comes to discussion about cops, it's open season. If you ain't been a motor cop, you got no business talking our business.

[Morrie]

One item that hasn't been mentioned in this thread is the police modified brakes. P bikes, at least those used in California, had a partially-linked system, instead of the fully-linked system that civilian bikes had. I got rid of my 1150RT because of that system which I think was big mistake on BMW's part. The company never admitted that, but has not used it on any of its subsequent models.

 

 

[Woodie]

P bikes, at least those used in California, had a partially-linked system, instead of the fully-linked system that civilian bikes had.

Would apply to the 1150 models.

 

[cali_beemer]

I tend to disagree on how they ride. Yes they do get alot of training but there are still alot of ego-crazy, cop riders. Some that just try to muscle things rather than use finess.

 

And you know this how? Were you involved in a study of the psyche of police motor officers or are you, as seems obvious to me, taking your preconceived ideas and prejudices and presenting them as fact?

 

The truth of the matter is, the vast majority of motor officers are proud professionals who damn well know how to ride and who don't, as a rule, abuse their equipment. That's a fact founded on knowledge and experience, not baseless conjecture.

 

Actually I have talked to alot of CHP officers and there are some that would even admit this. Sorry if that hurts your feelings. I spoke with a CHP officer outside a quicky mart while he was on break. We started talking and I asked him about the bikes. I even brought up the used RT-P's. He said he would never buy one with the way some of the guys beat on them. He went on to talk about the weaknesses of the bikes and how he didnt believe they should even be using a modified civilian bike with the abuse they give them. Thats straight from a CHP officer, but you are correct I must just be making comments about some study of the psyche.

[R80RTKen]

I used to hang out at the shop that worked on the police bikes (town name excluded to protect the guilty)

 

They get beat like rental cars by cops who know the town gets new bikes every couple years. The FLH Police bikes were run up the the redline, idled for hours while a cop with a radar gun waited for the next victim, and then ridden 1/4 mile to pull the guy over, and then left idling again for the 20 minutes it took to process the ticket / run the plate..

 

Cop bikes are viewed as "not mine" by their riders, with little exception, at least at the Hometown Police Garage.

 

You hometown may differ, but I know the 4 cops that beat the snot out of the town fleet, and I wouldnt touch one of those bikes.

 

 

[XTrooper]

 

Actually I have talked to alot of CHP officers and there are some that would even admit this. Sorry if that hurts your feelings.

 

Hell, why didn't you say that in the first place?! You actually "talked" to "alot" of CHP officers?! Wow! That automatically makes you an expert on motor officers, their attitudes, their motives, and their skill level. If your intent was to make yourself look as silly as possible, you've done a commendable job. "I'm not a motor officer, but I did stay once at a Holiday Express!"

 

Sorry if this hurts your feelings, but a few conversations with amazingly candid CHP officers, compared to a long career in law enforcement and having actually been a motor officer, is laughable.

 

I spoke with a CHP officer outside a quicky mart while he was on break. We started talking and I asked him about the bikes. I even brought up the used RT-P's. He said he would never buy one with the way some of the guys beat on them. He went on to talk about the weaknesses of the bikes and how he didnt believe they should even be using a modified civilian bike with the abuse they give them. Thats straight from a CHP officer, but you are correct I must just be making comments about some study of the psyche.

 

Assuming this conversation actually occurred, it is, first, the opinion of one officer and cannot be the basis for any valid conclusions. Second, even if every word in this conversation is accepted as gospel, no reasonable person could make the huge leap from them to your previous statements quoted below.

 

"The RT-P's get ridden hard and often by guys that dont know how to ride them in the first place."

 

"Yes they do get alot of training but there are still alot of ego-crazy, cop riders."

 

These statements are pure bigotry supported by nothing but your own prejudices. Now I know it's embarrassing to have this pointed out, but there's a lesson to be learned here. When stating our opinions, especially when presenting them as though they were fact, we should always be certain we actually know what in hell we're talking about. When it comes to motor officers, you don't.

 

 

 

[BabyCow]

Steve. Don't you know it is hard to reason with generalisations, ignorance and prejudice? . Here we only keep Police cars and bikes for 40,000 kms/24,000 miles. If you can find one with a detailed ride and service history from wherever you are they can be a good buy. Most Police riders (as most responsible riders do) realise that the bike needs to be very well maintained to be ridden at the higher speeds involved in law enforcement. What the non leo experts fail to point out is that Police bikes are also used for many tasks that do not involve speed for e.g. low speed VIP escorts. We have a unit here and that is all they do. Those type of bikes would be an absolute bargain

[jeffg47]

Guys: Thanks for all the replies to my initial inquiry about the RT-P model. I think that my best bet for a used RT will be to look for a civilian model ( pererabley local) that has been pampered. That being said I'd like to know what model year would provide the best bang for the buck. I'll start a thread for that separately. Thanks again,

Jeff

[lvnvbiker]

OK fellas lets try to at least appear to get along, everyone back to thier corners now please. I look at retired RT-Ps like I would any other high mile well maintianed vehicle, with both eyes open. From my experiance with motor cops ( family members, friends, and as an HD tech.) they do a very good job of taking care of the bikes they are issued as that is "thier" bike most times. It lives with them just like a K9 lives with its handler, and due to the ribbing they get when "demoted" to cage riding when the bike is down they are driven to keep it ridable. The RTPs here in NLV have all been fitted with Touratech ceramic clutch plates due to the factory ones not holding up to the way the bike has to be ridden performing police work (ie being slipped, friction zone training and dry clutches don't jive) and if anything fails it is replaced with not only what works best be it factory or aftermarket, but with top of the line gear, because that bike is a tool that the Motor depends on. The bikes used to be "miled" or "timed" out rather often, but now that the economy is in the can they will be higher mile and older machines but still well cared for. What you need to keep in mind is that they were not "pleasure" bikes but instead they were "tools" and have been treated as such. Knowing that the bike has most likely been pushed to its limits in the line of duty you realize that things can give out, and will at some time possibly 5 miles down the road from where you purchased it. These are the risks we all take with used bikes no matter who we get them from, and if the bike is nearly free there may be a reason for it.

That being said you are probably better off going with a civilian bike unless you have deep pockets or are really handy with a wrench and are willing to fix what breaks along the way.

[MotorinLA]

Guys: Thanks for all the replies to my initial inquiry about the RT-P model. I think that my best bet for a used RT will be to look for a civilian model ( pererabley local) that has been pampered. That being said I'd like to know what model year would provide the best bang for the buck. I'll start a thread for that separately. Thanks again,

Jeff

 

Just like buying a civilian bike from a private party, or a dealership, can be tricky, so is buying a RT-P from an auction or dealership. Judging from the way some guys ride their civilian bikes, you may get an "abused" bike just as easily from this kind of a seller as from a law enforcement agency.

 

Things to consider:

If you buy a RT-P that was used in a small municipality, it may have more "hard miles" on it than if you buy one from a larger agency, or a municipality in a large metro area. The reason for this is that officers in large agencies and metro-type municipalities often commute to and from work on their bikes and as a result the majority of the miles on the bike are freeway/highway "commuter miles". So, 60,000 miles is not the same wear and tear for all locations.

 

Many agencies use certified BMW dealerships for service, so the maintenance on these bikes should be very good.

 

At least in the Los Angeles area, Motor Officers are generally assigned their bikes and therefore take better care of their motorcycles, as it is "their" bike and typically the officer's main form of transportation to and from work.

 

I ride my bike hard, but I don't abuse it.

 

If I was offered to buy my R1200RT-P after it is retired, I'd jump on the opportunity, as long as the price was right.

 

As far as participants here making claims that motor officers don't know how to ride, I suggest looking at the great number of motor videos posted on YouTube, or even better go spend a day at a local Motor Rodeo, it's good entertainment and you might even learn something

 

 

[R80RTKen]

Bide your time and look for a well loved, low mile, pre-farkled version. I did that several years ago, took me 3 months and a couple day trips to find the right one. Your gonna love the bike, so take your time and find the best specimin you can!

-Ken

[lacofdfireman]

I am no expert on this topic because I am a Fireman and not a Cop but I do get to work around "Motor" officers alot... Having owned a previous 99 RT-P I often like to talk to the different Motor officers about there bikes.... Los Angeles County has gone from the Kawi's and Harleys to the BMW's... Every Motor officer I have talked to that has made the switch has eventually loved the BMW and would not give it up... Some did take awhile but I haven't met one yet that wished he was still on a Kawi or Harley... And about taking care of there Motor's... One thing that I have heard from multiple officers is that this bike is there pride and joy... Also that because of the dangers associated with the job of being a Motor Officer they keep there bikes in top running condition.. If there is ever any hint of a problem they have it looked at... You don't want things going wrong when involved in a pursuit or maneuvering in heavy traffic situations where their safety could be compromised.... If anything the officers I have talked to have stated there Motor's are over maintained..... I say buy one... I hope to own another one some day...

[yabadabapal]

Some good pointers on this thread. I really like the black and whites, and I think the engine guard is a lucky thing to have when you need it. The officers I know, are all great bike riders, and they take really good care of their machines. I think the idea mentioned about looking up the history of the bike as you should with any used bike purchase is a good idea and then if you can, talk to the officer who rode it and Im sure he will give you some pointers on the bike and maybe some pointers on riding as well.

I say go for it!

[ratfink]

Seems to me there are alot of generalazations made regarding RT-P's mostly made based on CHP units.

 

My bike came with system cases. I bought it at 42K miles, it was auctioned off based on age and upgrades to 1150's. It was serviced and maintained by an independent, certified BMW mechanic. It was not on a BMW lease program.

 

I like the crash bars, they are a great place to mount lights.

 

 

Police are like everyone else when it comes to riding styles and the way they treat their bikes and the conditions they ride in. The impression I have with my bike is that it was assigned to one Highway Patrol officer that did everything possible to keep it in parade condition. Negative generalizations about motor officers are unfair.