Stupid Tupperware Hardware Question

[moshe_levy]

All-

 

For some reason, the hardware holding the side tupperware to the gas tank on my '04 RT is giving me grief. The little buttonhead allens are refusing to go all the way into their thread bores, stopping about halfway out. This is using the "short" buttons no less. I've never cross threaded or forced them, and now 2 or 3 of them act all buggered.

 

I took off all the tupperware to get a better look, and it seems as though the metal threaded bores are molded into the tank somehow. How the hell do you fix this so the buttons sit nice and flush again? Is this common?

 

-MKL (next time I'll get a GS and won't have tupperware to deal with)

[moshe_levy]

Ooops - sorry - meant to post this in "Oilheads" but don't know how to move this there....

 

-MKL

[AndyS]

All-

 

..... The little buttonhead allens are refusing to go all the way into their thread bores, stopping about halfway out. This is using the "short" buttons no less. I've never cross threaded or forced them, and now 2 or 3 of them act all buggered.

 

I took off all the tupperware to get a better look, and it seems as though the metal threaded bores are molded into the tank somehow. How the hell do you fix this so the buttons sit nice and flush again? Is this common?

 

-

 

I'll try to answer your questions but probably in reverse order.

 

It is easyish to cross thread the screws. I would recommend screwing them all the way in with just a 1/4" drive without the ratchet handle so that you can apply little or no torque to the fastener.

If there is ANY resistance, unscrew fully, check the angles and try again - gently.

 

How did you get the tupperware off if the fasteners were gauled in place?

 

With the tupperware off, can you screw a new fastener easily into the nutsert in the tank? if so check the threads on your screws are not at all damaged.

 

If it is apparent that the nutserts in the tank are damaged then you have I am afraid been heavy handed.

 

However, if you are VERY careful you can chase the threads out with a tap.

 

Ensure you use a new high quality second or plug tap. Also ensure you use cutting paste/oil. If the tap is poor quality/dull/unlubricated, then there is a good chance of destroying the nusert and cause it to spin in its housing.

These cannot be properly replaced but there are bodges....Let's only go there if we really need to.

 

All the best with your checks. Keep us posted.

 

Andy

[Ken H.]

If only a couple of the inserts turn out to be actually boogered, what a lot of people do is simply abandon using the messed up ones. Then glue or similar a screw head on to the Tupperware for cosmetic reasons only. That top row doesn’t really do much, and if just one on each side is still good, that’s all you really need.

[John844]

Another option if the others don't work out is to shorten the two screws.

 

I have one on my bike that got damaged by someone???. I tried repeatedly to get the screw to start without cross threading, but had damaged it too badly. I didn't have a tap handy, so I took a grinder to the screw and shortened it enough to allow it to tighten, but using less threads. If I ever find a tap, I can replace the screw. If it gets worse, I have the option of gluing the head onto the tupperware like Ken mentioned.

[Chris K]

I had this problem on my '99RT and I did as Andy suggested. I found the correct size tap, used a little 3in1 oil for lubricant and used the t handle that came with the tap kit. I then cleaned out the holes using compressed air. Problem solved!

[boatzo]

I had this problem on my '99RT and I did as Andy suggested. I found the correct size tap, used a little 3in1 oil for lubricant and used the t handle that came with the tap kit. I then cleaned out the holes using compressed air. Problem solved!

 

What is the correct size tap?

[GordonB]

You did not mention in which order you set your screws. ALWAYS install the three (each side) fuel tank screws first. This allows wiggling the tupperware just so to allow the screws to go in easier. If the tupperware is slightly off angle, and screwing all the other fasteners first can do this, the screws will only go in a about half way.

[BeamieToo]

The thread is M6.

Cross check with an M6 nut to be sure.

[BeamieToo]

The thread is M6.

Cross check with an M6 nut to be sure.

 

Correction...

 

This should be M4.

 

I was too late to edit the post.

[kobi1]

I had the same problem with the acorn nuts. It's a pretty bad design in my opinion. In the end, I ended up with 2 stripped nuts. To resolve the issue, I CAREFULLY drilled out the plastic on the tank and removed the damaged nuts. Then I purchased some 1/4" (I think) aluminum rod, the correct drill bit and tap from Ace Hardware, and some plastic epoxy.

 

I took the rod, and using a small drill press, I bored holes in the middle, tapped the hole and used a chop saw to cut it to length. I placed the cut section into the hole and epoxyed it in place.

 

The original design is pretty poor because the threads are at the bottom of a 1/2" - 3/4" hole. It is difficult to get the screw started in the acorn nut and unless you are careful, it is easy to strip the threads. With my fix, the threads are at the top of the hole and go in without problem every time. It's not pretty but it works well and the ugly part is beneath the tupperwear. I have put 10,000 miles on the bike since making this repair and no problems.

 

If you don't have a drill press you could try a local machine shop like NAPA. I purchased a small very cheap Chinese knockoff brand drill press for $35 for this job. It has come in handy for other projects and as I always tell my wife, he who dies with the most tools wins...

 

Good luck!

[AndyS]

.....

The original design is pretty poor because the threads are at the bottom of a 1/2" - 3/4" hole. It is difficult to get the screw started in the acorn nut and unless you are careful, it is easy to strip the threads. With my fix, the threads are at the top of the hole and go in without problem every time. Good luck!

 

Sorry to disagree with you Kobi1, but having the threads at the bottom is a good thing, because this will help correct any angular misalignment of the screw before the threads bite.

Also the original is a better design than using aluminium as a 'nut'. Aluminium is particularly inapropriate due to its very poor tensile strength and would normally be reinforced by using helicoils (or equivelant).

To be honest the only weekness of the current design is MAINLY due to operator error. (overtightening, mis-alignment and general ham fistedness [of which I am guilty of at times]).

 

The observation made by another poster was to ensure these screws are (carefully) fitted first before any other screws can kick the tupperware into misalignment is worth considering, but for me, it is just a case of eyeballing the holes and ensure you don't try to use the screws to pull the tupperware into alignment.

 

Andy

[Jerry Johnston]

If you tap them out use a bottoming type tap or grind the end till it's not tapered.

Also use a compressor and blow them out or the residue will fill the bottom.

[AndyS]

If you tap them out use a bottoming type tap or grind the end till it's not tapered.

Also use a compressor and blow them out or the residue will fill the bottom.

 

+1

 

Andy

[kobi1]

right , wrong or idifferent, the fix that I suggested is a way to fix the problem if you stripped the acorn nuts and cannot tap them. That is what happened to me. I guess we will have to agree to disagree on the design.

[Argon]

I have this problem too, and it is especially difficult to get the screws in if you have replaced the tupperware screws with a set of stainless screws. The original screws have a tapered end that seems to help in getting the screw started. All the stainless kits I have seen have screws that are flat at the bottom. So if you go with the stainless, it will be even more important to be careful with installation. I have been very careful and have not completely stripped any of the nuts yet, but some are getting difficult.

 

As for the design, the part I think is poor is that you can't easily replace the nuts in the gas tank. All the other nuts are clips that can be replaced without any trouble. There should have been some realization on part of the engineers that the tank nuts would likely strip over the life of the bike, and I can't believe it would be a big deal to design a nut that could be removed.

[billy bee]

The thread is M6.

Cross check with an M6 nut to be sure.

 

Correction...

 

This should be M4.

 

I was too late to edit the post.

 

I thought they were M5 x .8, no?

 

Anyway, may have already been said, but my tank screws bottom out before the others. A 16mm screw is too long. The factory screws also have a point on them and they both thread better and don't bottom out, although their overall length is still 16mm-ish.

 

I have a mish-mosh of screws...some SS, some factory black anodized. I make sure the factory black ones go into the tank bung or nutsert or whatever you call it. Also, I use slightly thicker plastic washers. The black factory ones were getting destroyed. I found some opaque ones that help the cause, too.

 

bb