HID Choices

[AndyS]

I noted that Boffin has just ordered an HID conversion for his R1150RT.

I think I am on the edge of doing the same thing to improve my dismal dip beam (I currently use PIAA bulbs).

 

Now, here's the question for those of you who have done it.

Do you need to do much hacking around to get the bulb to fit?

Do you need to leave the rear plastic cover off?

What colour temperature did you choose and why?

Did you choose the 35 or 50 watt option - is there much difference in performance?

 

Thanks

Andy

[Boffin]

I went for the brightest output - the lowest colour temp - because I forgot to check the number before I hit the submit

 

The DHL tracking number shows the unit has just left Heathrow so should be with me this PM or tomorrow AM.

 

I intend to remove my speakers (long overdue) and fit the ballast there.

 

Steve1962 hopes to drop by and doccument the process.

 

I should have a spare dip unit for a R1150RT available at the end of the process.....

 

 

Andy

[AndyS]

Nice, keep us all posted.

Andy

[ESokoloff]

Now, here's the question for those of you who have done it.

Do you need to do much hacking around to get the bulb to fit?

Do you need to leave the rear plastic cover off?

What color temperature did you choose and why?

Did you choose the 35 or 50 watt option - is there much difference in performance?

 

Thanks

Andy

 

Well I'm no expert but I (think) I know the answers to 1 or 2 of the questions.

 

I'm in California & these kits are not legal for on road use (may be the same in all the US) on any vehicle that did not come with HID's from the factory.

 

For that reason on my 03 RT I would use a lower color to "blend in" so as to not attract LEO attention.

I'm thinking 4300k as it's a white light and yields about the most light output of all colors.

I think incandescent (halogen) bulbs are about 3???k and a bit yellow by comparison.

 

On my 05 KS I might go with a bit hotter as I'm under the impression that the newer versions come with HID's from the factory.

5000k or 6000k might be my choice as a bit of a blue tinge may make the bike stand out a bit & thus perhaps make it more visible.

 

For a few extra $/euros, you could order a set or two different color bulb(s) & experiment.

 

As far as wattage, my thought is to stick to 35 watt as it's about 3 times brighter then halogen & I do not want to be irresponsible to other motorists (low beam).

[Unhofliche_Gesundheit]

i have captured a vendor link from another post - perhaps of interest: http://vvme.com/catalog/list-s-10145-10146.html

 

dumb question perhaps but what do we need the "Single Beam Model" or the "Bi-Xenon Model (Dual Beam Xenon) " ?

 

assuming just for low beam ( i almost never use the highbeam).

 

"there are no dumb questions, just dumb people.." ;^)

 

 

[11101110]

the "dual beam" version has a solenoid that will move the bulb into the position of the high beam filiment. If you have the H4 bulb you will see two filiments each at different locations. Only one is on at a time so moving the bulb would have the same effect as changing filiments.

[Urban Surfer]

I'm going to go with an HID high beem (takes an H3 bulb. Who makes a good one.

[Boffin]

My kit has arrived - quality looks just dandy - a plug&play instalation.

 

Come November I am ordering their H4-2 set, to fit to my little Guzzi. This has two elements, a HID low-beam and a halogen high beam.

 

Andy

[AndyS]

Glad it looks OK, keep us updated on the installation techniques and give us as much of an unbiased appraisal as is possible on real world results. I really want this to be good for your night riding experience.

Andy

[Boffin]

Andy,

I have already drawn up an installation and commissioning plan, to include before and after photographs of the light field. These will be taken using my Sony Alpha 100 camera on manual exposure so that the change in brighness will be apparent in the pictures.

 

The kit contains reasonable instructions, though one possible weakness is that the DC input plug can be reversed. The (waterproof) connector has provision for polarising but the receptical on the ballast does not. It is however, marked + and - so red to + and black to - will be th eorder of the day.

 

The kit has two balast units (one for each lamp), each about 100mm (4 inches) square, and 25mm (1 inch) deep. The input DC for the balast is taken from the original lamp connector. The output to the HID bulb is on two polarised leads. All connectors are waterproof types, except the ones that go to the vehicle headlight connector. The four wires are passed through a grommet. The wires are about 18 inches long.

 

There is a simple strap-type mounting bracket (one for each ballast) that needs a single bolt mounting and should be mounted in "a drafty place".

 

Once a position for the balast has been identified, mounting will consist of drilling a hole in the headlamp rear-cover to take the grommet. Disconnecting and removing the OEM bulb. Installing the HID bulb, connecting the two wires to the HID bulb, then connceting the Red wire to the low-beam supply and the black to ground.

 

Retro-fitting the OEM bulb will be a simple matter should you wish to reverse the installation for whatever reason (failure, remorse or MOT:grin:)

 

Full doccumented actual installation to follow after the weekend

 

Andy

[ESokoloff]

:lurk:

[AndyS]

Andy,

I have already drawn up an installation and commissioning plan, to include before and after photographs of the light field. These will be taken using my Sony Alpha 100 camera on manual exposure so that the change in brighness will be apparent in the pictures.

 

This is a very worthwhile real world operation. It will be good to see if this dip beam improves the fringe detail which is so lacking with the OE.

 

Andy

[RickB]

Well? The suspense is killing me...

[AndyS]

Well? The suspense is killing me...

 

Me too!!

[Boffin]

Well? The suspense is killing me...

 

Me too!!

 

OK, OK - its been a busy week. I didn't get to fit the HID until Monday and in my rush I forgot to take 'before' pictures.

 

I will sort out the pictures I took of the install and should post later today.

 

The installation was quite straigtforward, taking about three hours in all, which included removing/refitting the tupperware, screen and dash panels, removing the speakers (boy are they heavy!), deciding on ballast location and adjusting headlight alignment.

 

Full details to follow in a few hours...

 

Andy

[ESokoloff]

Full details to follow in a few hours...

 

Andy

 

Tough crowd today Andy

[Boffin]

Well, at last here are the details of the install.

 

The HID kit looked to be quite well made to me and carried the Hella brand and a 'designed in Germany' statement. The unit shipped from Beijing and it has a build-date of 11 Oct 08.

 

 

There is two of everything shown above in the kit, with the lamp well protected in a plastic shipping can. The two spade connectors live inside the headlamp cover and plug into the connector that normally plugs onto the headlamp bulb. The black wire is ground and so goes to the brown wire on the connector.

These wires provide the power to the ballast and from that the HID lamp. No modifications to the bikes wiring are required.

 

 

A Halfords brand +90% halogen H7 on the left with the HID lamp on the right. It is difficult to see here, but the HID arc capsule is at the same height as the filament in the halogen lamp.

 

I mounted the ballast in the space vacated by the right-hand speaker.

 

 

The mounting bracket had to be bent to fit but was quite malleable. I made up a pad of duct-tape and taped that to the bikes wiring loom that runs under the top-left of the ballast - I would rather chafe duct-tape than wiring

 

The only cutting required is where the HID wiring has to penetrate the headlamp rear-cover. The instructions say to drill a 23mm hole, I only had a 22mm drill and it seemed to work fine. The cover is shown in-place on the headlight here.

 

 

I used a spade-type wood bit to drill the hole about 1 inch down from the top of the cover.

 

Looking up from under the bike you can see the duct-tape pad in place.

 

 

The HID lamp in place, plenty of clearance behind the high-beam reflector. Yes, my bike is filthy - all those flies.

 

 

White light - and lots of it!

 

 

 

The light-field. The dark arch-shaped area is where the direct light is blocked by the high-beam reflector.

 

From a little further back the extent of the coverage is clear. The light looks high because the bike is on the main-stand, sitting on the rear wheel and on an up-slope.

 

 

All-in-all, an easy installation with a minimum of intrusion into the bike. For those of you who want to keep their speakers, there were plenty of other places the ballast could have gone - I just liked the ease of access.

 

I am now considering buying a H3 set for the main-beam, but I suspect that the conversion may be a little more difficult due to BMWs idiosyncratic mounting system for that bulb.

 

On an 1100, or any other bike with H4 bulbs, www.vvme.com sell either a H4-2 with HID low and hallogen main, or a telescopic H4 that moves the capsule back behing a shield for low-beam and forwards for high. The telescopic kit is more expensive.

 

Full gallery with captions can be seen here but there is no more than I have posted above.

 

Any questions? Feel free to ask.

 

Andy

[11101110]

All-in-all, an easy installation with a minimum of intrusion into the bike. For those of you who want to keep their speakers, there were plenty of other places the ballast could have gone - I just liked the ease of access.

 

Andy

 

I was able to mount my ballast (same kit) on the lower inside of the left speaker. Didn't even have to remove the speaker. The bracket tab is swandwiched between what I remember to be an oil cooler mount point. The bracket is thin enough to not shorten he screw too much. I did, of coures, bent the bracket to 90 deg to get it to mount. Then I placed a all weather nylon ty-rap around the ballast and one of the frame bars. You could get another one on the opposite side or maybe two (hid foglights )

 

My capsule was off a bit when compared to the H7 filiment making my beam point higher than normal. I can correct but probably won't be able to when loaded for traveling.

[Boffin]

All-in-all, an easy installation with a minimum of intrusion into the bike. For those of you who want to keep their speakers, there were plenty of other places the ballast could have gone - I just liked the ease of access.

 

Andy

 

I was able to mount my ballast (same kit) on the lower inside of the left speaker. Didn't even have to remove the speaker. The bracket tab is swandwiched between what I remember to be an oil cooler mount point. The bracket is thin enough to not shorten he screw too much. I did, of coures, bent the bracket to 90 deg to get it to mount. Then I placed a all weather nylon ty-rap around the ballast and one of the frame bars. You could get another one on the opposite side or maybe two (hid foglights )

 

My capsule was off a bit when compared to the H7 filiment making my beam point higher than normal. I can correct but probably won't be able to when loaded for traveling.

 

Just under the point where the bowden cable attaches to the headlight is a 13mm hex, this will adjust the base setting of the lamp, giving you the adjustment you need on the dash control.

[11101110]

All-in-all, an easy installation with a minimum of intrusion into the bike. For those of you who want to keep their speakers, there were plenty of other places the ballast could have gone - I just liked the ease of access.

 

Andy

 

I was able to mount my ballast (same kit) on the lower inside of the left speaker. Didn't even have to remove the speaker. The bracket tab is swandwiched between what I remember to be an oil cooler mount point. The bracket is thin enough to not shorten he screw too much. I did, of coures, bent the bracket to 90 deg to get it to mount. Then I placed a all weather nylon ty-rap around the ballast and one of the frame bars. You could get another one on the opposite side or maybe two (hid foglights )

 

My capsule was off a bit when compared to the H7 filiment making my beam point higher than normal. I can correct but probably won't be able to when loaded for traveling.

 

Just under the point where the bowden cable attaches to the headlight is a 13mm hex, this will adjust the base setting of the lamp, giving you the adjustment you need on the dash control.

 

Sweet. thanks Boffin, I'll have to take a look tomorrow after I give some attention to my car.

[NoHeat]

Very nice pictorial presentation, Andy.

 

Puts my earlier one to shame.

[Danny caddyshack Noonan]

I just completed installation of a vvme HID kit on a R1100RT. I ordered the H4-3 kit (single bulb style) for a car. A solenoid exposes the bulb to the high beam reflector when on high.

Downside: The kit comes with a single relay but two ballasts and bulbs. It can't be used for two R1100's without plumbing a new relay for the extra ballast and bulb.

Upside: The kit comes with an extra bulb and ballast should either fail.

I put the relay behind the RID and the ballast tied to the bottom of the truss coming off of the frame at the tank. I didn't use their brackets.

I took photos on manual setting but don't see a difference. I think there is an auto shutter that I didn't account for. It looks significantly brighter on my driveway at night though.

74C5

 

[ESokoloff]

Any questions? Feel free to ask.

 

 

Well done Andy!!!

 

So what temperature did you use?

[Boffin]

Any questions? Feel free to ask.

 

 

Well done Andy!!!

 

So what temperature did you use?

 

4300K, I wanted the least blue output. Plus I forgot to look at the options in the drop-down box so got the default

 

Andy

[ESokoloff]

4300K, I wanted the least blue output. Plus I forgot to look at the options in the drop-down box so got the default

 

If I'm not mistaken, thats the color with the highest (visible) light output.

 

Some times it's better to be lucky then good

[AndyS]

 

4300K, I wanted the least blue output. Plus I forgot to look at the options in the drop-down box so got the default

 

Andy

 

So, any riding impression yet.

I noticed the other day that with my dip beam set correctly the main beam didn't add much more to the range, so if it is possible I was thinking of adjusting the main beam higher and with the new more powerful infill HID dip we should start to get towards better night time riding.

 

So in addition to your riding impression, the nest question is, can the Main beam be adjusted independantly from the dip on an 1150RT?

 

Andy

[Boffin]

 

4300K, I wanted the least blue output. Plus I forgot to look at the options in the drop-down box so got the default

 

Andy

 

So, any riding impression yet.

I noticed the other day that with my dip beam set correctly the main beam didn't add much more to the range, so if it is possible I was thinking of adjusting the main beam higher and with the new more powerful infill HID dip we should start to get towards better night time riding.

 

So in addition to your riding impression, the nest question is, can the Main beam be adjusted independantly from the dip on an 1150RT?

 

Andy

 

I have only had one night ride so far - a home-bound commute. The light output on dip is excellent, but main is also needed. The UV spill form the HIDs caused road-signs to light up nicely, ditto cats-eyes. Unfortunately, the headlight aim adjustment affects the whole lamp assembly, so no independant adjust for high.

 

I also have two spots mounted on EMP brackets that are linked to main-beam and they fill in the sides of the main-beam light-field - the stock main-beam is a spotlight in itself IMHO. I am thinking about going HID on the supplementary lights and adding a switch as well as the main-beam triggered relay. I may swap the spot type lamp for a fog type, to get a broader spread of light.

 

 

Andy.

[Woodie]

On the 1100, you said it was brighter. Did it change the pattern much? Fill in the sides, or more spotlightish? (that's a NEW word!)

 

Is this the one you got?

HID Conversion Kits - Bi-Xenon Model (Dual Beam Xenon)

 

 

 

[flars]

That's the kit I got for my 1100RS. The beam looks much wider than that of the stock bulb (i.e. more side spill), and a whole lot more 'whitish'. Riding down a tree lined road I can see much farther on low beam (and of course on high beam), and the sides of the road are much better lit.

 

[Danny caddyshack Noonan]

Woodie

That's the one...H4-3. Didn't have bulbs in tubes though.

 

The R1100RT pattern is better filled with light, slightly more pulled down on the sides (probably focal length change from the source). The hole I used to have dead center about 200 ft (60.96 meters for SI unit folks) out looks to be gone. But, I need a dark freeway to verify that and that is hard to comeby.

High beam is very nice, need dark freeway though. Now to install the $15 driving lights from Walmart for fill-in and conspicuity and we're good to go.

 

 

[wbrissette]

Well I'm no expert but I (think) I know the answers to 1 or 2 of the questions.

 

I'm in California & these kits are not legal for on road use (may be the same in all the US) on any vehicle that did not come with HID's from the factory.

 

For that reason on my 03 RT I would use a lower color to "blend in" so as to not attract LEO attention.

 

I just got back from a trip with my '04 RT and spent a week there riding around with my bike that has HIDs on it. Had several CHP officers clock me with the radar gun throughout my travels, either they don't seem to care about the HID lights, or aren't enforcing it, because on multiple occasions they were running radar at night and could obviously tell I had HID lights installed.

 

I'm sure they aren't legal, but I'm wondering if they are even bothering writing tickets for them. Then again, I'm not sure what the rule is when they are installed on a bike that is from out-of-state where HIDs aren't illegal???

 

To answer one of the questions, you do have to usually modify the rubber boot on the light assembly to get the HID to fit, but otherwise it's pretty much straight forward.

 

Wayne

[AndyS]

I have only had one night ride so far

 

Andy.

 

Had any more night rides yet?

 

Andy

[Boffin]

I have only had one night ride so far

 

Andy.

 

Had any more night rides yet?

 

Andy

 

I now have several night rides under my belt now and the additional lighting on low beam is superb. It does however, show up how poor the high-beam is. I am now looking to get a set of H3 lights to swap out the halogens in my over-the-mirror spot lights.

 

Andy

[E30TECH]

I have only had one night ride so far

 

Andy.

 

Had any more night rides yet?

 

Andy

 

I now have several night rides under my belt now and the additional lighting on low beam is superb. It does however, show up how poor the high-beam is. I am now looking to get a set of H3 lights to swap out the halogens in my over-the-mirror spot lights.

 

Andy

 

I was considering doing the same - converting my hellas (over-the mirror) to HID after riding at night with my new HID kit. I got the 4300K as well.

 

BTW - AFAIK, no drop in HID kit is legal in any state as they are not DOT approved. I have my HID and PIAA 1100s *under the oil cooler* and have never been 'flashed' by oncoming drivers at night.

 

 

[Boffin]

I have only had one night ride so far

 

Andy.

 

Had any more night rides yet?

 

Andy

 

I now have several night rides under my belt now and the additional lighting on low beam is superb. It does however, show up how poor the high-beam is. I am now looking to get a set of H3 lights to swap out the halogens in my over-the-mirror spot lights.

 

Andy

 

I was considering doing the same - converting my hellas (over-the mirror) to HID after riding at night with my new HID kit. I got the 4300K as well.

 

BTW - AFAIK, no drop in HID kit is legal in any state as they are not DOT approved. I have my HID and PIAA 1100s *under the oil cooler* and have never been 'flashed' by oncoming drivers at night.

 

 

They're not legal in the UK on motorcycles first registered after April 1985 either as they are not E-Marked - so don't tell any cops about mine.

 

Andy

[E30TECH]

weren't you the guy flipping off the red light camera at 180km/h

[Chip]

I ordered, and have received, the dual beam xeon kit (for my R1100RT).

 

As for installation, I've got most of it figured out (e.g., wires into the ballast, where/how to hang it, etc.) but I'm not sure where to plug in the 3-way plug that comes off the relay.

 

Here is the link to the exact kit I bought

http://www.vvme.com/product/detail-20022.html

You can see the plug at the bottom left of the kit.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

 

[Boffin]

The OEM lighting plug goes to the unit at some point - from the look of the connectors on that, at a guess, I'd say it plugs into the light connector.

Andy

[Danny caddyshack Noonan]

Chip,

what Andy says.

Run the old H4 plug into the three prong connector coming off of the relay. The other large connector end of the relay goes into the ballast and two lines come from the ballast to the lamp and one small connector wire comes from the relay to the lamp for the high beam solenoid.

 

good luck

74C5

[bmwmick]

Has anyone noticed any electrical noise from these HID lamps? I'm going to play with some HID's for my RT and K-bike as long as the audio stuff is still noise free.

 

Thanks for the great write-ups.

 

Mick

[Boffin]

Has anyone noticed any electrical noise from these HID lamps? I'm going to play with some HID's for my RT and K-bike as long as the audio stuff is still noise free.

 

Thanks for the great write-ups.

 

Mick

 

No noise on my bike. I have the HID ballast mounted well away from my Zumo, which handles all the Audio. My intercom these days is a Scala Teamset.

 

Andy

[sdpc2]

Maybe i am being dense on this one, but....

 

We are talking about HID for the LOW beam? Not for the HIGH beam?

 

Correct?

 

That is what i would prefer to have on my bike.

[Danny caddyshack Noonan]

sdpc2

without going back through all the posts, not exactly.

The r1100rt HID conversion replaces the h4 hi/low with a single hid bulb. When commanded high, a solenoid exposes the high beam part of the reflector and lens to the arc and you get "high beam". When on low, a shield attached to the solenoid covers everything except the low reflector and lens. This is the H4-3 or bi-zenon conversion.

 

74C5

[Chip]

Thank you gentlemen. It became fairly obvious once I took out the old bulb and disconnected it. It's almost impossible to screw things up as the connectors are well thought out...

 

However, I've hooked everything up and have had no success getting the light to work. Have tried both ballasts, both bulbs, and both sets of wires. All ground wires are connected as well.

 

I've also disconnected the relay (via the 3-way connector) and plugged the old bulb back it. The old bulb works fine.

 

I suspect the relay in the kit (I think that's what you call it...the little box that the 3-way plug goes to) is faulty but I do not know how, or have the appropriate instruments, to test it.

 

I've sent an email to VVME to explain the situation. I'll keep you informed of how they handle this.

[flars]

The wire going to the ballast has a positive (red wire) and negative wire. The ballast itself has a + sign on one side of the body. You probably have the plug to the ballast backwards (DAMHIK).

The relay just activates the electomagnet that pulls the bulb back (the light is on high beam when first turned on, then retracts immediately to low beam)

[Chip]

First let me state that I do not understand electricity. I don't even know why it doesn't just flow out of the electrical sockets on the walls.

 

My problem was actually more silly than having the wires on the ballast backward. Did you know that if you ground the ground wire and the positive (red) wire, it is virtually impossible to get power to whatever device you connected?

 

Once I connected the red/power wire to the battery...beautiful light.

 

If I ever posted my wrenching work on this site, it would probably be:

First do X, then Y, then redo X, do Z, realize something's not right. Go back and read the directions. Repeat.

[11101110]

For those of us who still have high frequency hearing, you can detect a high pitch whine form the ballast/bulb which dimishes as the bulb warms up.

 

Just be happy you didn't try and ground the positive from the battery.

[bmwmick]

Thanks Andy!! Thanks EE!! My Zumo should be OK too.

I have it feeding a Starcom.

 

Mick

[BostonBagger]

I have a 2004 R1150RT. I've only had it 6 months and am researching HID lighting. I believe that my RT currently has a H7 55w bulb for low beam, and a H3 55W bulb for high beam. I have speakers installed and wonder if I really need both bulbs replaced, since this will require 2 ballasts and inverters. I really don't use my high beams much as I also have MotoLights driving lights. Am I correct and do I need both?

 

I guess is my only concern is heat at the bulb, and at the inverter / ballast, since both are in a warm area near the oil cooler.

 

Cheers,

[sid]

I assume you need a H7 to do the high beam conversion on an 1150? Anyone tried it yet.

 

I'll preface that I haven't looked at the high beam placement, but understand from others it's a bear to get to.