Accelerating out of danger - bad idea?

[JayW]

In a recent magazine article on riding safely, the author advised against ever using this strategy. I have about decided that he is wrong. One circumstance that comes to mind where this can be life-saving is when passing a car that begins to encroach on my lane. If I am more than halfway past the errant driver, then I'll just quickly throttle on by -perhaps edging left as I do so- before (s)he has a chance to intersect my path. Of course this assumes a clear road ahead. This seems a better strategy than braking, slowing, honking, or just moving over.

 

Am I correct here? In what other circumstances can the throttle be used as a safety device?

 

Jay

[MattS]

Whatever you do ... you'll last and live longest if you don't listen to dogmatic BS. Like never accelerate out of danger.

 

The canonical example of when you might accelerate out of danger would be at a standstill, in the path of either a very fast train or a very large truck.

 

Another would be stopped at a red light. Someone coming at 100mph from behind? See them in your mirror? Here's a thought: run the red and save your life. Again, accelerating out of danger.

[ShovelStrokeEd]

If that were the case, I'd be dead a long time ago.

I routinely use the ability of my bike to accelerate briskly to get myself away from situations I see developing around/in front of me.

 

Someone closing on my six and a car next to me? I ain't slowing down to blend in behind the guy, increasing the closure rate of the guy catching me. A quick twist of the wrist and I'm past the car alongside and then blend in front of him.

 

2 lane road and a big truck running slow in front? Down to second and around him. Right friggin' now. 2 places you don't want to spend any time are behind a big truck and alongside. Acceleration minimizes both.

 

There are lots more. Whoever wrote that article is a moron.

[Wooster]

Whatever you do ... you'll last and live longest if you don't listen to dogmatic BS.

 

And a big 'you betcha' to that.

 

In OP's example (car drifting into my lane), I've accelerated forward yet afterwards wondered if braking would have removed me from car's "future space" faster. I'm thinking sudden braking while travelling at 75 pmh has greater affect on velocity than my 90 hp 640 lb RT's acceleration can accomplish.

 

Again, a hearty second for "no dogmatic bs".

 

Wondering Wooster

[T__]

In a recent magazine article on riding safely, the author advised against ever using this strategy. I have about decided that he is wrong. One circumstance that comes to mind where this can be life-saving is when passing a car that begins to encroach on my lane. If I am more than halfway past the errant driver, then I'll just quickly throttle on by -perhaps edging left as I do so- before (s)he has a chance to intersect my path. Of course this assumes a clear road ahead. This seems a better strategy than braking, slowing, honking, or just moving over.

 

Am I correct here? In what other circumstances can the throttle be used as a safety device?

 

Jay

 

Jay, I think you will find an awful lot of very experienced motorcyclists use the accelerate or accelerate/deviate form of dangerous situation avoidance.. Actually,, personally I seldom use brakes as a way of avoiding most situations preferring to either accelerate or deviate from travel path to avoid potential problems.. To me,, braking limits your options to a select few & once initiated pretty well commits you to that avenue…

 

Twisty

[Ken H.]

Am I correct here?

I would say a qualified yes. We need to be ready and able to use all of the tools at our disposal to keep us out of harm. And the quick maneuverability and acceleration of a motorcycle are certainly two of them to apply when appropriate. Just as the ability successfully execute an emergency stop. Different situations demand different reactions and to categorically dismiss any option as inappropriate is just plain silly. At best.

 

What magazine and article was it?

[steve.foote]

I agree with Ken on this. You have to keep all of your options open. Sometimes accelerating is the answer, but sometimes the brakes are a better solution. I wouldn't take any viable option off the table.

[bimmers]

when being a little faster than others you are in control to a different degree. Accelerating I always do when passing trucks etc, accelerating out of their wind envelope. I do think there is a fine line between braking and letting someone go or speeding by them but you are in control in both cases.

No dogma, all cases are circumstancial and no fixed rules apply.

The weight of a RT vs a crotch rocket also makes a difference for riding style.

 

h

[PT Steve]

As Ed says, I'd have died a long time ago if it was a bad idea. Many situations require a "speed change". Whether the "change" is up or down depends on many factors. I'd guess speeding up is valid almost as often as slowing down.

[JayW]

What magazine and article was it?

 

I am pretty sure it was in either Cycle World or Rider Magazine and it was sometime last year. The original safety article did not mention acceleration as an option, and a reader wrote in a month or 2 later to correct this omission. The editor responded that he did not recommend ever using this as a strategy to avoid a wreck.

 

Jay

[ShovelStrokeEd]

I'm betting on Rider.

[Bullett]

I agree with the other responders to your post. Keep your options open. Acceleration and deceleration have each saved my skin. I'm not willing to take either off the table in the battle for survival.

 

In conjunction with acceleration/deceleration I use situational awareness to "shoot for the hole" as it were.

 

I think the most important skill you can develop as a rider is the recognition that you are invisible but not invulnerable.

 

Ride safely, my friend.

[Bullett]

I'm sorry, I didn't respond to your question. I used acceleration in December to get out of the way of a truck that was moving into my space on the freeway in heavy traffic. Thank goodness there was plenty of clear space in front of me.

 

Just one example of acceleration to save your skin.

[smiller]

Accelerating out of danger can be risky. Better to lay it down.

[steve.foote]

Accelerating out of danger can be risky. Better to lay it down.

 

[Mister Tee]

In a recent magazine article on riding safely, the author advised against ever using this strategy. I have about decided that he is wrong. One circumstance that comes to mind where this can be life-saving is when passing a car that begins to encroach on my lane. If I am more than halfway past the errant driver, then I'll just quickly throttle on by -perhaps edging left as I do so- before (s)he has a chance to intersect my path. Of course this assumes a clear road ahead. This seems a better strategy than braking, slowing, honking, or just moving over.

 

Am I correct here? In what other circumstances can the throttle be used as a safety device?

 

Jay

 

Jay, I think you will find an awful lot of very experienced motorcyclists use the accelerate or accelerate/deviate form of dangerous situation avoidance.. Actually,, personally I seldom use brakes as a way of avoiding most situations preferring to either accelerate or deviate from travel path to avoid potential problems.. To me,, braking limits your options to a select few & once initiated pretty well commits you to that avenue…

 

Twisty

 

This pretty much sums up my view on the subject.

[HappyMan]

I learned long ago, the accelerator is your friend. Keep it close and treat it with love and kindness but don't ever ignore it.

[Mister Tee]

I learned long ago, the accelerator is your friend. Keep it close and treat it with love and kindness but don't ever ignore it.

 

Well it is, and also realize that motorcycle suspensions in particular perform best when they are loaded. This is why, other things being equal, if you have a choice of braking or accelerating to get around something, you are usually better accelerating, particularly if you have to maneuver.

 

But in the end it's a judgment call. Hopefully with enough riding experience you have the reflexes to gauge whether to go fast, go slow, or cut right or left. That's all a part of riding. There is no one answer for all situations.

[russell_bynum]

In a recent magazine article on riding safely, the author advised against ever using this strategy. I have about decided that he is wrong. One circumstance that comes to mind where this can be life-saving is when passing a car that begins to encroach on my lane. If I am more than halfway past the errant driver, then I'll just quickly throttle on by -perhaps edging left as I do so- before (s)he has a chance to intersect my path. Of course this assumes a clear road ahead. This seems a better strategy than braking, slowing, honking, or just moving over.

 

Am I correct here? In what other circumstances can the throttle be used as a safety device?

 

Jay

 

The phrase you're looking for is "Flaming Idiot".

 

There are plenty of situations that are made better with more throttle.

[tobyzusa]

My guess is that the misguided author was concluding that you end up carrying more energy after accelerating than before, which is only an issue IF you crash. If you just avoided a crash, it was a mighty fine use of energy.

[Channa]

The lane encroachment scenario happened to me only last Friday travelling to work on the motorway.

 

A van started to drift out. Perhaps I was in his blind spot he had no rear view mirror and was dependant upon rear observation via his door mirrors.

 

This in itself I guess is good riding observation, and perhaps not a consideration to a less experienced motorist.I am suggesting that perhaps I ride anticipating this very situation

 

Anyway instinctively, I accelerated rather than braked.

 

Still an unnerving experience but I would agree that acceleration is as much a tool at our disposal has brakes.

 

Channa

[AviP]

Almost everyday I ride, there are 2 instances of a driver not seeing me due to no fault of mine. 99% of those times, my response is to accelerate out of the situation. I have been riding for over 20 years and the accelerator is my preferred get_out_of_trouble answer.

[eddd]

"Officer, I wasn't speeding, I was just accelerating to get out of danger."

 

"No, really, sir, the members on the BMWSportTouring site said it was OK!"

 

 

Kidding aside, I use it just like others have mentioned, including when I'm uncomfortable with someone who is driving too close behind me. Sometimes you can let them go by, but other times a quick burst of speed gets me away from the congestion.

[outpost22]

Perhaps the article was reffering to "if you're being tailgated, don't accelerate", which is the statement made at the motorcycle safety class I attended. I guess the rational is that you only go faster and still get tailgated. However, even then to accelerate and move over is still in my arsenal no matter what they say

[ShovelStrokeEd]

Perhaps the article was reffering to "if you're being tailgated, don't accelerate", which is the statement made at the motorcycle safety class I attended.

 

Was that statement made by one of the instructors or some village idiot who happened to be walking by the classroom?

 

What, pray tell, was the solution to being tail gated? Slow down? Maintain speed till you have to brake for something and get squashed like a bug?

 

Acceleration creates a gap which reduced the danger to YOU. Use the gap to find a place in the traffic stream to your right to move over.

[MrHondamatic]

Acceleration worked good for me last spring when I had my encounter with a school bus. Had I hit the brakes, she would have ran over me for certain. No place to go, other than ahead, and the bus was too long to let it pass if I had tried braking. She was determined to take my space as the road went from two lanes to one.

[JayW]

My guess is that the misguided author was concluding that you end up carrying more energy after accelerating than before, which is only an issue IF you crash. If you just avoided a crash, it was a mighty fine use of energy.

 

Yes, the editors explanation was along these lines.

 

It sounds like we are all in general agreement on this issue - it's rare that I see that happen on this forum.

 

Jay

[Ken H.]

I am suggesting that perhaps I ride anticipating this very situation

Yes indeed. A good mantra is - spend as little time between the back and the front bumper of another vehicle as possible. I'll even delay slightly beginning an overtake if needed until I can confirm the entire path beyond the other vehicle is clear. It only takes the slightest amount of adjustment in timeing to smooth your own flow enough to make it happen.

[Channa]

part of effective riding is understanding the limitations of other vehicles, hence my reference to the mirror arrangement on trucks and vans.

 

It is also worth bearing in mind if on a sunny day shadow is in front of the bike, then often vehicles being overtook wont see you for the sun is reflecting off thier mirrors...equally oncoming traffic may be blinded too as they have the sun direct in their faces.

 

FWIW I consider myself still learning after 25 years,one slip bearing in mind our vulnerability can result in an early appointment with our maker.

 

I find it all quite interesting,a few months ago I was returning to my bike to find a very attractive young lady admiring my bike. It turned out she wanted to pass her bike test. As you do , I offered words of encouragement and suggested the skills learnt would help in her driving too..for example looking at lamposts or hedgerow lines provides a clue to severity of bends etc ..all which we accept as the norm.

 

You would have thought I had given her a winning lottery ticket. Wow I never even thought of that she said.

 

More a reflection on non bikers than her attitude I suspect. It is important we continue to learn,evaluate and understand the environments in which we ride..

 

Anyway steps off soapbox lol.

 

channa

[outpost22]

Perhaps the article was reffering to "if you're being tailgated, don't accelerate", which is the statement made at the motorcycle safety class I attended.

 

Was that statement made by one of the instructors or some village idiot who happened to be walking by the classroom?

 

What, pray tell, was the solution to being tail gated? Slow down? Maintain speed till you have to brake for something and get squashed like a bug?

 

Acceleration creates a gap which reduced the danger to YOU. Use the gap to find a place in the traffic stream to your right to move over.

 

The statement was made by our Harley mounted instructor. Perhaps he was limited in acceleration O.k. no Harley bashing!

 

I too thought it was idiotic, and nobody in the class believed him anyway on that point.

[tallman]

If the O.P. is refering to the article in this month's Motorcycle Consumer News, that author was speaking of a particualr situation.

That being at the end of a passing lane with vehicle merging before you passed them, and on a cruiser with modest acceleration.

'The point was to anticipate and not put yourself in such a situation. The author did use a fine brush, then a medium one, but certainly not the broad strokes some are implying.

Best wishes.

[Quinn]

Devil's advocate time:

 

By increasing speed you are increasing impact if something goes wrong.

You are decreasing maneuvering time and distance.

You are therefore decreasing the potential of any other options--swerve, stop, swear, honk, etc.

 

As far as passing, I do the same thing--goose it to get by and avoid riding with a vehicle beside me. But I really do think that I can decellerate faster than I can accelerate if it starts moving into my lane. The only problem would be leaned over in a curve.

 

A goodly while ago someone posted about getting forced onto the shoulder (complete with rumble strips and debrie) by an 18 wheeler coming into his lane. His reaction was to accellerate and get back on the road in front of the truck. I couldn't figure why he felt that was a better answer than just slowing down until the truck was past and then getting back on road.

[Axe]

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Perhaps the article was referring to "if you're being tailgated, don't accelerate", which is the statement made at the motorcycle safety class I attended.

 

 

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Was that statement made by one of the instructors or some village idiot who happened to be walking by the classroom?

 

What, pray tell, was the solution to being tail gated? Slow down? Maintain speed till you have to brake for something and get squashed like a bug?

 

Acceleration creates a gap which reduced the danger to YOU. Use the gap to find a place in the traffic stream to your right to move over.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

 

The instructor may not have communicated the material correctly if that is the only thing the class took away from the discussion on dealing with tailgaters. The scenario usually discussed is when there is another vehicle in front with no lane change option and you are being followed to closely. Page 32 of the MSF BRC Riders Handbook.

 

"it is best to increase your following distance from vehicles ahead to give yourself time and space to execute smooth, gradual stops. This avoids putting tailgating drivers in a position that requires them to make a quick stop."

Some other options to respond to a tailgating driver

 

- Flash your brake light (communicate your intentions

- Gradually reduce speed to create more space in front

- Maintain lane position that discourages sharing the lane

- Turn at the next opportunity, into a street or parking lot, to allow the person

tailgating to pass you.

 

 

Obviously this is a very dangerous situation and one we spend some time on making sure new riders understand. I found it best to expand on the written material here by asking What if Questions to the group and let a discussion take place.

If all your RiderCoach said was don't accelerate and that was what the class understood, he was wrong and did not do the correct job. If there were two instructors, I am surprised it was not corrected by the second. We most always teach in pairs for just that reason, if one of us misses something or leaves the wrong impression it is the responsibility of the other RideCoach to correct it.

[dba]

I would think that any tactic, maneuver or even levitation if you can do it; that will allow you to bring you and your bike home safe and sound and discuss the issue in forums like this is the right move. Anyone that would profess not using all options available is mistaken. Hope is not a strategy.

[leikam]

Thanks for the clarification, Tim. The quality of "safety" advice in the mags is pretty uneven so I didn't find it hard to believe the worst.

[russell_bynum]

By increasing speed you are increasing impact if something goes wrong.

You are decreasing maneuvering time and distance.

You are therefore decreasing the potential of any other options--swerve, stop, swear, honk, etc.

 

For sure.

 

Another thing we always talk about is if you're in a corner and it tightens up, just lean the bike farther.

 

That's generally good advice because the majority of the time, the bike isn't anywhere near the limits of lean/grip, and increasing lean to get you though the turn is better than running wide and having a head-on with another vehicle or running off the road.

 

But...you can't ignore the fact that adding lean reduces your margin even more.

 

Likewise, accelerating to get out of danger does add energy to the equation and it reduces the amount of time you'll have to react.

 

But I really do think that I can decellerate faster than I can accelerate if it starts moving into my lane. The only problem would be leaned over in a curve.

 

For me, my answer to that problem would depend on the situation. I'd rather go forward because I've already got a good picture of what is happening ahead of me. I do not have nearly as complete a picture of what's going on behind me. I'm already on the gas and I'm in the right gear, so giving it more throttle is no big deal. braking would require that I roll off the gas and apply the brakes, dealing with the weight transfer of the bike, etc. On Lisa's DR200, acceleration is not nearly as viable an option as it is on my Tuono.

 

Every choice has its upsides and downsides. Sometimes it is better/easier to accelerate and sometimes it is better to brake.

 

As for a curve...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to apply the brakes and scrub off some speed while the bike is leaned.

[Boffin]

As for a curve...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to apply the brakes and scrub off some speed while the bike is leaned.

 

I have practiced and had to use braking in a curve using BMW's idiotic fully linked brakes. It just takes a little more care.

Andy

[russell_bynum]

As for a curve...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to apply the brakes and scrub off some speed while the bike is leaned.

 

I have practiced and had to use braking in a curve using BMW's idiotic fully linked brakes. It just takes a little more care.

Andy

 

Thanks for the correction...

 

It takes more care, and you can't brake as hard, but you can definitely do it...if you've practiced.

[Mister Tee]

>...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to

 

Oh, yeah. Glad you reminded me. I haven't considered that. Wow, good bye trail braking.

[russell_bynum]

>...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to

 

Oh, yeah. Glad you reminded me. I haven't considered that. Wow, good bye trail braking.

 

Your 2008 R1200RT doesn't have the system I was referring to.

[Mister Tee]

>...if you've practiced braking with the bike leaned (and if you don't have BMW's idiotic fully-linked brakes), it is quite easy and drama-free to

 

Oh, yeah. Glad you reminded me. I haven't considered that. Wow, good bye trail braking.

 

Your 2008 R1200RT doesn't have the system I was referring to.

 

Hmm...okay good to know.

[Channa]

Ok, I am playing devils advocate before you want to shoot me.

 

Some sensible solutions have been offered.

 

However, How many of these situations are avoidable in the first place ? by correct planning ? use of the carriage way? and speed ?

 

A human trait it would appear is to apportion fault, to me this indicates an attitude issue.

 

I think a point missed so far is advice riding in the pro active sense. Acute acceleration / braking is reactive ?.

 

What is more important is avoiding being in that situation to start off withand perhaps how we ride and the attiude we adopt can assist in that ?

 

Occurences would be far fewer and I guess we still need to have a contingency/technique to get out of a pickle.

 

 

I hope I make sense

 

Channa

[Trajan]

A fist full of throttle or an accelerator on the floor are both useful when trying to escape a bad spot. My fighter pilot buddy calls it "Zone Five".

 

Situational Awareness is very important, but chance and the general abundance of people not paying attention means we need to keep our options open. I'll slow down if I can.

 

One several occasions, in my pickup truck and my bike, I have dropped a gear, opened the throttle wide, and moved out of a situation that would have resulted in bent sheet metal and paperwork. Every time, it was reflexive. I didn't even think about it until it was over. Usually I drop RPM's by 100 or 200 and move slowly away from trouble. The other guy usually doesn't notice. But when you need to go - GO!!

[keithb]

Jay

A dually turned left directly in front of my best friend about 6 years ago and he purposely accelerated so when he hit the front right wheel of the dually he would clear the hood of the truck vs. crushing into the side of the truck. When he did this the front windshield of his R1100GS broke off against his chest. He used it like a sled and slid for about 150 feet on it. Probably saved his life by accelerating in that situation. And his Motorport gear saved his Arse. Not a mark on him.

[Silver Surfer/AKAButters]

Jay

A dually turned left directly in front of my best friend about 6 years ago and he purposely accelerated so when he hit the front right wheel of the dually he would clear the hood of the truck vs. crushing into the side of the truck. When he did this the front windshield of his R1100GS broke off against his chest. He used it like a sled and slid for about 150 feet on it. Probably saved his life by accelerating in that situation. And his Motorport gear saved his Arse. Not a mark on him.

 

:rofl

 

That definitiely gets the spin doctor award. Too funny.

[JayW]

Wow! Sounds like a scene straight out of a Mission Impossible movie.

 

Jay

[tobyzusa]

I've been waiting for someone to say it, but it hasn't happened, so here goes:

 

When in doubt, power out!

[keithb]

Yeah we were laughing about it as well the other night when we were talking about it. I guess I had forgotten the part about the screen when it happened. All I know is he said he cleared the hood of the truck at about 45-50 mph and he did not have a mark.

 

On the other hand, my cousin was on a 4 wheeler and hit the front grille of a pickup truck with his chest and almost died. How ironic.

[HenWin]

Motorcycle Consumer News, March 2008 Page 46

[Ken H.]

[

Motorcycle Consumer News, March 2008 Page 46

Presuming your referring to Ken Condon's March article, I can't imagine that is what the original poster of this thread was referring to.

 

Mr. Condon’s article was referring to a specific situation of a bad pass. A mistake the rider made to start with, beginning the pass under poor circumstances and then trying to salvage it by continuing to add bad to bad. Vs. just abandoning, aborting the pass.

 

Not at all the, ‘Can acceleration sometimes be your friend?’ angle being discussed here.

 

The esteemed Mr. Condon occasionally post here, perhaps he will see this and comment himself.