R1100 Transmission Problems

[wallace66]

I've been interested in getting a R1100R bike. But I've heard that there were some issues with the transmission on a certain year range. Is this true? What years were affected? What was the problem? Was there a certain mileage it happened at? What was the repair costs? If all this is true, is there any way besides a shop receipt of repair to tell if a R bike is heading to the failure?

 

Thanks for any help, that's a lot of question but I don't want to get a new/used bike and get stung!!

 

GaryS

[smiller]

Hi Gary,

 

What you are probably referring to is an issue with the '96 and earlier transmissions that caused accelerated shift fork wear in some units. Most were not affected, but the ones that were tended to exhibit the problem in the 30k-60k mile range. The problem isn't difficult to fix but not inexpensive either.

 

I wouldn't necessarily avoid a pre-97 model because of this but it is something to be aware of. The problem usually manifests itself as what feels like a brief interruption or hiccup in power after shifting into 2nd or 3rd gear and applying throttle. Another tell-tale sign is a golden metallic sheen in drained transmission oil. On a very low miles bike the problem may simply not have surfaced yet, and of course may never surface, but do pay attention when you check out the bike. On a high-miles (>60k) bike if the problem hasn't surfaced yet it probably isn't going to.

[bobanddianne]

Gary,

The 1100 transmission problems were with the 94-96 models. The shift mechanism was changed in 97 and there were no problems thereafter. The 97 transmission is a direct drop-in replacement for the 94 trans.

But the cost is in the $2000 + labor area.

I know because that's what we did with our 94 R1100RS. The problem typically is having the transmission skip in third gear when under acceleration... and is slowly gets worse. We swaped in a new transmission at 130,000 miles and life has been wonderful ever since.

-Bob & Dianne-

07 R1200RT Dream Machine 12,000 miles

94 R1100RS Rocket Ship 142,000 miles

[Mark K]

Hi Gary,

 

What you are probably referring to is an issue with the '96 and earlier transmissions that caused accelerated shift fork wear in some units. Most were not affected, but the ones that were tended to exhibit the problem in the 30k-60k mile range. The problem isn't difficult to fix but not inexpensive either.

 

I wouldn't necessarily avoid a pre-97 model because of this but it is something to be aware of. The problem usually manifests itself as what feels like a brief interruption or hiccup in power after shifting into 2nd or 3rd gear and applying throttle. Another tell-tale sign is a golden metallic sheen in drained transmission oil. On a very low miles bike the problem may simply not have surfaced yet, and of course may never surface, but do pay attention when you check out the bike. On a high-miles (>60k) bike if the problem hasn't surfaced yet it probably isn't going to.

 

 

Yep, that's a perfect description. I have one of those. It's really not a huge issue for me -- as long as I remember not to get on it too hard in second gear. My problem only manifests itself in second thus far and has been that way for almost two years I would guess. It's a mild annoyance at its worst, but is on my to-do list. I've been putting it off as I don't really want to send my gearbox to Canada (Bruno's) and be without it for an extended period of time. That, and I'm not sure I'll remember how to put it back together when it is returned.

 

Knock on wood....it has not gotten any worse and I don't beleive it will catostrophically fail on me either. The only additional precaution I take is to change the tranny oil every time I change the engine oil, just to keep an eye on things.

 

Bottom line -- I wouldn't let that discourage you from looking at the older 1100s. There are many reasons I still prefer an 1100 over an 1150 (search the board) and would not hesitate to buy one again.

 

Hope that helps!

Mark

[wallace66]

Thanks for the info guys. It seems as if I wait for a 97 or 98 I would be out of the woods and not have to worry. Pay a little more up front than possibly a lot more later in time and money. Darn shame, I've seen some real good deals on 96/97 R1100R's lately,with bags, shield and heated grips in the low $3k range. The one's I looked at had between 27k and 31k miles.

[NonComp]

Now here's something interesting about this tranny issue: My bike is just coming up on 60K miles. When I got it, I took it apart to put a clutch in it (at 58K miles). At that time, I split the gearbox to change the seals. I posted photos of shifter forks on this forum a couple of months back. They basically show no wear.

 

But... I have the skipping issue in second gear. Doesn't manifest itself very often, but it has happened twice in the same spot on the same hill in my neighbourhood (I shift earlier now on that hill).

 

So... does the skip in second gear cause the wear on the shifter forks, or does the wear cause the skipping? Or... none of the above?

[Mark K]

[Anton Largiader]

The skipping causes the wear, from what I've seen. The worn shift dogs, and any misalignment issues that the tranny has, start the downward spiral.

[smiller]

They basically show no wear.

That's kind of curious if you have the skipping problem.

 

My impression was that the failure occurred like this:

 

Due to the fact that the M94 transmission does not have undercut shift dogs, under normal operation the gears in some units (depending on luck-of-the-draw manufacturing tolerances) tend to want to walk out of gear. The only thing preventing them from doing this are the shift forks, and the gear constantly bearing against the shift forks causes the shift forks to wear (the gears are made of very hard metal, the shift forks very soft.) Eventually one or more shift forks get a groove worn in them, and when this happens they can no longer place the gear into full engagement during a shift. Because of this the gear dogs don't fully engage as a result of the initial shift action, and they slip and catch again a revolution or so later with the bike under power (causing the 'skip' the rider feels when this problem exists.) Later (M97) transmissions do not exhibit the problem as their shift dogs are undercut (meaning that they have a beveled surface that causes the dogs to engage more securely.) This both makes shifts more positive and prevents the gears from walking out of position under power, preventing shift fork wear.

 

The only weird thing here is that you should have seen some wear on your shift forks if you have the skipping problem. My guess is that your unit may have the 'walk out of gear' problem to such a bad extent that it does it even with good shift forks.

[NonComp]

Here's the photo that I took of the shift forks. One does have some visible wear, but it was very slight.

[smiller]

Yeah, those are essentially normal, no significant wear on any of them. Weird.

 

Attached is what a chewed fork looks like.

[NonComp]

I guess there is always the possibility that the gearbox had already been rebuilt once when I bought the bike. But then, why wouldn't they have done the clutch at the same time? Maybe the gearbox went much earlier in the life of the bike? Time to call in the folks from CSI - they would know!

[Christo]

Hello from 2015.

 

Please forgive the bumping of an old post, but same (possible) issue for me, except that I don't feel the hiccup in 2nd or 3rd gear, only 5th I think. Usually a few seconds after shifting into gear, there's a momentary hitch and then back to normal. Can this be the same problem, but in 5th gear? It's a 1995 R1100RS with 40,000 miles. Thanks for any input.

[dirtrider]

Evening SnakePliskin

 

Possibly the same problem but I doubt it. Sounds way more like 5th gear slider is dropping out of engagement due to rounded engagement dogs (common problem on the 95 1100's). Basically the trans has to be removed & the gears/sliders replaced OR maybe have the parts recut with a back angle cut.