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Redline Heavy ShockProof


Lone_RT_rider

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Lone_RT_rider

Upon having the transmission rebuilt for my R1100RT, the rebuilder ( Bruno ) suggested that I use Redline Heavy ShockProof™ Gear Oil. Info on it can be seen here. Does anyone have any information on this product, or any long term use reports?

 

Shawn

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I've been using it for 5-6 years. First in a R1100RS and now in a 1100GS. I noticed smoother, easier shifting after switching over from what ever I was using before.

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I've been using it about 2 1/2 years, first on an 1100GS and now on my 1150RT. I like it, seems to smooth out the rough gearbox edges a bit. My RT goes into 1st easier w/ it.

 

It also fixed my intermittently non functioning Neutral light...

 

You believe that, right? lmao.gif

 

Yes, I know, coincidence.

 

 

 

 

The Redline is really viscous and clingy. Put the bottle in a bucket of really hot water before attempting to get it into your bike.

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The Redline Heavy ShockProof is a lot heavier (75W-250, according to Redline) than the recommended oil and most reports seem to indicate that it does smooth shift quality somewhat (probably due to its heavier weight)... but I'm not sure that this necessarily coincides with a longer transmission life. Not sure if it could really hurt anything but then again BMW (or Getrag) probably recommended 90W for a reason.

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Lone_RT_rider
The Redline Heavy ShockProof is a lot heavier (75W-250, according to Redline) than the recommended oil and most reports seem to indicate that it does smooth shift quality somewhat (probably due to its heavier weight)... but I'm not sure that this necessarily coincides with a longer transmission life. BMW (or Getrag) probably recommended 90W for a reason.

 

Seth,

 

Just exploring the possibilities here and of course this may be marketing rhetoric off the Redline site but from what I understand (YMMV) the use of the thicker grades of lubricants in transmissions and differentials is always a tradeoff between having the best protection for the teeth of the gears in the form of a very thick and "shock absorbing" fluid and also have a fluid thin enough to be able to flow properly into any and all areas where the lubricant is needed. Given this criteria I found two quotes on the Redline site interesting......

 

A unique lubricant containing a suspension of solid microscopic particles as an extreme pressure agent--unique solid dispersion which cushions gear teeth to help prevent tooth breakage and allows the use of lower viscosities.

 

That would cover the ability to absorb the shock of the gears meshing together, and.....

 

The viscosity characteristics allow the lubricant to resist throw-off and provide a film thickness similar to a 75W250 grade, while providing the same low fluid friction as an SAE 75W90.

 

That last part about low fluid friction would not only cover the ability to get the fluid where it needs to go but also reduce energy losses in the transmission that you would have with a higher grade oil such as the 250W. I think what they are trying to say where is that the oil gives you the shock protection of a 250W and otherwise acts like that of a 75W90 grade. Best of both worlds?

 

Whatcha think? Just mulling this over like we are talking over beers here... Bench racing if you will.

 

Shawn

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Whatcha think? Just mulling this over like we are talking over beers here... Bench racing if you will.
Well, my personal thought is that the Redline oil will neither help nor hurt anything significantly. As a general rule I don't like to stray too far from manufacturer's recommendations without a very good reason and I don't see one here, but then again I've never noticed a significant difference in shift quality no matter what type/weight of gear oil is in my transmission. That said, if you do feel there is a worthwhile improvement then I doubt that the Redline oil would do you any harm as lots of people seem to be using it without incident (not counting Scott's experience, but I don't think that had anything to do with the oil.)
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Well guess what, I changed my gear lube for the first time in our R1200GS (did the 24K a bit early for the trip), I put plain old 90W dino in it and, guess what, it shifts smoother and quieter.

 

I think a lot of, 'I just put ____________ fill in favorite brand here and it's wonderful' is just because something new is in it.

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I think a lot of, 'I just put ____________ fill in favorite brand here and it's wonderful' is just because something new is in it.
Well I didn't want to say it, but... yeah... wink.gif
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Lone_RT_rider

Realizing of course that I am about to enter into an extremely subjective statement, I have seen differences in shift quality from different blends of gear oil in the past. Over the life of the RT so far this has been my experience.

 

Bike new = Original Dino BMW gear lube (Baseline for ease of shifing)

 

Bike at 12K = Switched to BMW synthetic 75W140 and noticed a considerable decrease in shifting force needed. On a scale of 1 to 10 (1, worst and so on) I think the shifting ease went from 5 to 7.

 

Bike at around 36K = I briefly tried the Mobil 1 90W synthetic gear oil to save $$$. I immediately found the shifting to not only be worse than the BMW synthetic, but also seem worse than the BMW dino gear oil (subjective rating of 2). I promptly purchased another quart of the BMW 75W140 synthetic and replace the fluid again post haste which put the ease of shifting right back to the point it had been before at a rating of 7.

 

The BMW synthetic 75W140 has been tried and true. The only reason I am even considering the Redline fluid at this point is the fact that Bruno (who knows these transmissions inside and out) stated that he really thinks that the Redline helps the M-97 gearbox to last longer and be more durable.

 

*shrug*... I am a bit torn here. I am one of the first to try a new set of tires when they come out, but changing gear oil when you just shelled out over $1100.00 dollars to get a transmission rebuilt seems somehow more daunting. crazy.gif

 

Shawn

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Lone_RT_rider
I think a lot of, 'I just put ____________ fill in favorite brand here and it's wonderful' is just because something new is in it.
Well I didn't want to say it, but... yeah... wink.gif

 

Oh, there is no doubt that fresh fluid will absorb shock better and therefore shift better than before you changed it out. My experience with the Mobil 1 (see above) is what led me to think there is a difference between some brands. Also, like I said... the only reason I am even thinking about this is the recommendation of my transmission rebuilder.

 

Shawn

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The only reason I am even considering the Redline fluid at this point is the fact that Bruno (who knows these transmissions inside and out) stated that he really thinks that the Redline helps the M-97 gearbox to last longer and be more durable.
That's interesting (I've seen a few people mention that) and I'd be curious to know why he feels that way. The bearings on the later models are all sealed so I don't see how they would know or care what oil is in there, and similarly the gearsets are pretty rugged and I have a difficult time seeing why they would be at all sensitive to oil weight as long as it is anywhere near close to the recommendation. I wonder what sort of failure or wear he is trying to protect against?
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Lone_RT_rider
I wonder what sort of failure or wear he is trying to protect against?

 

I know that besides the input shaft and bearing failure, one of the big failure modes is the shift fork wearing out. Maybe the oil does a better job of protecting the anodizing at the tip of the shift fork?

 

Shawn

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I know that besides the input shaft and bearing failure, one of the big failure modes is the shift fork wearing out. Maybe the oil does a better job of protecting the anodizing at the tip of the shift fork?
I have a hard time imagining how a slightly heavier oil could make much difference in that regard. And the shift fork problem is due to the lack of undercut gears on the pre-M97 models, and if you have one of those Bruno undercuts the shift dogs so as to avoid a repeat of the problem... so not sure why there would be any remaining issue to protect against.

 

Not arguing, just bench racing... grin.gif

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Lone_RT_rider
I know that besides the input shaft and bearing failure, one of the big failure modes is the shift fork wearing out. Maybe the oil does a better job of protecting the anodizing at the tip of the shift fork?
I have a hard time imagining how a slightly heavier oil could make much difference in that regard. And the shift fork problem is due to the lack of undercut gears on the pre-M97 models, and if you have one of those Bruno undercuts the shift dogs so as to avoid a repeat of the problem... so not sure why there would be any remaining issue to protect against.

 

Not arguing, just bench racing... grin.gif

 

Yep, Bruno worked the magic on the undercuts and went through this thing with a fine tooth comb. Other than possible reduction of impact forces on the tooth surface of the gears, I am at a loss for the advantages at this point. Maybe that reduction if force will help shifting. There are a lot of "ifs" at this point. Not to mention, getting a quart of this stuff is not that easy from a local standpoint. I have cyclegear calling redline today trying to find out cost/availability.

 

We shall see.....

 

Oh... and no worries... Bouncing ideas back and forth to think out the validity of things is why we have this board. That and trying to get through the work day without going insane. grin.gifthumbsup.gif

 

Shawn

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Paul Mihalka

My experience with my '99 R1100RT: Started obviously with the BMW factory fill. Shifting the typical clunk/clunk. When it became available, switched to BMW 75/140 synth. It did improve the shifting. Based on some recommendations, and noticing the the box shifted nicer when cold than when hot, I started using Red Line Heavy. Real improvement in shifting. No more clunk/clunk. Only down side is that in cold weather - freezing and under - shifting is stiff for the first few miles. You really had to preload the shifter for smooth changes. You should not have that problem in South Carolina. Bike sold with 170K miles, the last 70 with Redline. I know it is still running strong without gearbox problems.

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Lone_RT_rider
......*snip*...I started using Red Line Heavy. Real improvement in shifting. No more clunk/clunk. Only down side is that in cold weather - freezing and under - shifting is stiff for the first few miles. You really had to preload the shifter for smooth changes. You should not have that problem in South Carolina. Bike sold with 170K miles, the last 70 with Redline. I know it is still running strong without gearbox problems.

 

Paul, did you click on the link I provided at the start of the thread? If so, is this the same exact type of Redline oil you used? If so, did you change it at the BMW recomeneded intervals? If not was it more or less often?

 

Shawn

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Paul Mihalka
Paul, did you click on the link I provided at the start of the thread? If so, is this the same exact type of Redline oil you used? If so, did you change it at the BMW recomeneded intervals? If not was it more or less often?

 

Shawn

Yes, it was the Red Line Heavy Shockproof rated at 75/250 that I used. I change gear oils at about every 20K miles.
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Lone_RT_rider
Paul, did you click on the link I provided at the start of the thread? If so, is this the same exact type of Redline oil you used? If so, did you change it at the BMW recomeneded intervals? If not was it more or less often?

 

Shawn

Yes, it was the Red Line Heavy Shockproof rated at 75/250 that I used. I change gear oils at about every 20K miles.

 

Thanks Paul, very helpful information. smile.gif

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Upon having the transmission rebuilt for my R1100RT, the rebuilder ( Bruno ) suggested that I use Redline Heavy ShockProof™ Gear Oil. Info on it can be seen here. Does anyone have any information on this product, or any long term use reports?

 

Shawn

 

Shawn, I used the RL Heavy Shock Proof in my racing truck transmissions & differentials with very good success..

 

That is a very robust gear oil with great anti foaming ability & great gear tooth load protection..

 

I liked it so much in my trucks that I used it in my R1100 transmission & it quieted down a noisy gear box & improved the shift quality over both BMW gear oil & Mobil 1 gear oil..

 

When it came to my R1150 I just naturally used the RL heavy.. Didn’t work so good in that 6 speed gear box. Was quiet enough but made the shifting more difficult & caused more missed shifts than I liked.. I’m not real sure why it shifted poorly with the Red Line but my guess is there is more drag between the gears & the shafts that they spin on so the dogs have a harder time lining up on the shift..

 

There is nothing in that M-97 that will suffer form the use of Red Line Heavy as there are no Hypoid or other high loaded gear sets & no synchronizers to deal with.. That Red Line is very shear & foam resistant so should hold it’s base viscosity for a very long time..

 

If you do go with the Red Line Heavy it is difficult to get it all out at change time.. Change it only after a long high speed run the let it drain overnight (& even then some will stick the gear sets & inner trans case)..

 

Twisty

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