Brake Fluid Change/Flush - Integral ABS

[HoMa506]

I'm all for changing the brake fluid and understand why so when I brought my bike in for service they said it was due. I told them OK.

 

I just got the bill, beside the regular service was Brake Fluid Change/Flush - Integral ABS.

Labor - $352.80

Brake Fluid - $24.00

 

$352.80 Labor??? they already did it, they explained it but is this normal?

[Lawman]

yup.

[Tipover_Bob]

Al:

I believe you got normally, totally ripped. Unless your system is a whole lot different from mine, it should have taken about $5 worth of brake fluid and about 1/2 hour of labor.

 

Tipover Bob

[Ken H.]

Al:

I believe you got normally, totally ripped. Unless your system is a whole lot different from mine, it should have taken about $5 worth of brake fluid and about 1/2 hour of labor.

 

Tipover Bob

His system (1150) IS a whole lot different than yours (1100) and it's about two hours of labor and $350 is about normal.

[Tipover_Bob]

 

Tipover Bob

His system (1150) IS a whole lot different than yours (1100) and it's about two hours of labor and $350 is about normal.

 

Ken:

And it takes $24 worth of brake fluid????

 

Tipover Bob

[Stan Walker]

And it takes $24 worth of brake fluid????

 

Well, there are 5 circuits to flush, and two of the circuits easily use a can between them. So let's estimate that it take three times as much brake fluid to do the linked brakes on an 1150 as the non linked brakes on an earlier 1100.

 

Still not $24 if your price for a single can is really $5.00, but I expect that isn't BMW's current brake fluid price.

 

I do my own annual service on my 4 BMW's and the brakes get serviced every year. I usually start with 3 or 4 cans on the shelf (4 for the years I do the control circuits). That's basically 2 or 3 for the 1150 , and 1 for the other 3 bikes.

 

Stan

[Tipover_Bob]

Al:

It looks like I stand corrected regarding the price of doing a bleed for your system. The linked brake system is much more complicated than my R1100RS's system. However, I did run into some information that suggests the interval between bleeding the wheel cylinder and the servo systems on a linked system has been increased over the normal one year bleed that lots of us recommend. Also, simpler systems such as on my R1100 probably have the possibility of absorbing moisture quicker and might deem more frequent flushing.

 

Tipover Bob

[Stan Walker]

I did run into some information that suggests the interval between bleeding the wheel cylinder and the servo systems on a linked system has been increased

 

It's not clear in my head if that applies to all the bikes with servo brakes or only from some point going forward. My '02 was a very early bike, actually bought in April of '01. Until I see something in writing from BMW I'll continue to flush it on the original schedule. It costs very little (except time).

 

Stan

[Mark K]

I love my 1100

[keithb]

Just finished an '04 1150RT servo brake bleed + 24K mile service about 6 hours ago. The $350-$400 is the normal cost for this procedure from the dealer. However, if you had fabricated the funnel yourself the job would have cost you approx. $50 for the funnel and brake fluid (we used 3-12oz. bottles) + about 3 hours of your time to perform this service. We did not finish the clutch circuit because we did not have a bleed screw. ARGH!! Sorry you found out the hard way. I am sure that was a bitter pill to swallow. I would recommend that you attend a tech day in your area to learn how to service your bike yourself. The services we performed on this 04 RT today was quoted at $1000 and we did it for $300 which included parts + lunch for 4 guys. Helluva difference.

[Stan Walker]

I love my 1100

 

I have one of each '96 R1100RT and '02 R1150RT. The brakes are much easier to service on the 1100. As many have pointed out the powered servo brakes were a solution to a problem that we didn't have.

 

That having been said, my early '02's brakes have been flawless for it's first 91,000 plus miles. I don't feel they are overly sensitive, grabby, or hard to modulate. And keep in mind that 3 of my 4 bikes don't have servos. 2 of those bikes don't even have ABS. I tour. I commute in L.A. traffic. I even ride dirt from time to time.

 

Stan

[bmwdave152]

I just did a ABS flush and bleed. Plus the clutch. Used 3/4 of a large can. Took me all morning...but then again I'm slow.

[arbee]

 

 

 

I love my 1100

+1

definitely easier maintenance in a lot of aspects

 

The more i read about ABS in here the more satisfied i am

in removing mine completely(no more flashing lights ever)

 

I am also quite happy to say i wouldnt touch ABS with a forty foot barge pole ever again

 

Apologies to those ABS owners who are offended.

[philbytx]

Not offended in the least....just disappointed at you being such a Luddite

[drjay]

Okay, so in a separate post you guys convinced me to change the brake fluid in my '02 RT. I got the Clymer manual, spoke to the folks at the NH Max BMW (nice guys and gals!), purchased a MityVac and two 12oz bottles of fluid and when I got home I noticed the manual said to leave all Integral ABS brake fluid bleeding to the dealership because they have a MoDiTec diagnostic tool. Can you you folks clarify this? Am I to assume that I cannot just flush the system with new fluid as is written for the R1100RT. Also, do I need to purchase a special bleed nipple for the clutch fluid? I am a little new to maintaining my RT as I have always left it to local shops. I'm fairly mechanical and would just like to have the satisfaction and knowledge that the maintenance is being done well, so I thought I'd try doing it myself. Saving money is a nice perk too. Thanks for all the help; this forum is fantastic.

[HoMa506]

Thanks to ALL for your replies. Sounds like it's the norm and better left to the professionals.

 

How much is YOUR life worth to try and save a few bucks.

[philbytx]

Al,

Just an observation my old china

You can go on ad infitum/ad nauseum with the whole "how much is your life worth" stuff. Me, I've done most of the wrenching/maintenance on all my cars, RV's, motorcyles etc. even done more than my fair share of pre-flights on aircraft (and drove the AP's nuts with my squawks!) etc

I even do electrical work around the home

But, sometimes, you even can't trust the professionals to do the job right.

I ride my bike with my life in my hands...so what's the difference between that and some wrenching that I do and which may require a little more study and care to effect properly ?

[Stan Walker]

Am I to assume that I cannot just flush the system with new fluid as is written for the R1100RT.

 

That is 153% correct. The procedure is TOTALLY different. You MUST use the correct procedure or you will end up with no brakes at all.

 

That being said, there is no reason that anyone who can read and follow instructions and count higher that 4 should fear flushing their own brakes. It's easy, but does take a few hours to do.

 

Stan

[drjay]

So Stan, where can I find the proper flushing technique since it is not in the Clymer manual? Does it really require the MoDiTec unit? Unfortunately, I do not know of anyone in my area with a similar RT, and I will not likely get away to a tech day, so I must rely on this forum and other written material or not do it myself at all.

[BMW_Ken]

So Stan, where can I find the proper flushing technique since it is not in the Clymer manual? Does it really require the MoDiTec unit? Unfortunately, I do not know of anyone in my area with a similar RT, and I will not likely get away to a tech day, so I must rely on this forum and other written material or not do it myself at all.

 

 

I have found this article from the ADVrider.com "Hall of Wisdom" helpful; ABS-3 Service.

Also this thread by Jamie and Leslie.

[Tipover_Bob]

Mark:

I'm loving my R1100RS more every minute too.

 

Tipover Bob

[Nevets]

I am not a mechanical expert, but I have found that bleeding the control and wheel circuits on my 2003 1150 RT-P was not very difficult. In fact, it was easy enough, that I showed two or three other people how to do it. Sure I had to buy some plastic tubing, build a funnel (now there’s a high tech tool) and study the subject for an hour or so. Get the emotions out of the equation and look at it reasonably. If you want to spend about 4 hours total, you CAN do this yourself. Considering the time required to even get to the ABS system, what the dealer charges seems reasonable.

 

And in my humble opinion, the ABS system works great, having needed to use it twice today in fact. I’ll challenge anyone without ABS on the same bike to a “stopping contest”.

[Jim VonBaden]

The servo-ABS system IS a bit more complicated to service, but it really is not that difficult. Certainly not worth $350 if you are capable of doing it yourself.

 

My 1200DVD covers the servo-ABS system, and my 1100/1150 DVD covers the non-servo systems.

 

Both will give you step-by-step video instructions on how to do it, as well as demonstrations on each step, plus specifications.

 

The DVD's also cover all other needed regular maintenance.

 

Of course Jamie's post covers it neatly as well and with excellent instructions and still shots.

 

Jim

 

PS Not spam, just information.

[T__]

I'm all for changing the brake fluid and understand why so when I brought my bike in for service they said it was due. I told them OK.

 

I just got the bill, beside the regular service was Brake Fluid Change/Flush - Integral ABS.

Labor - $352.80

Brake Fluid - $24.00

 

$352.80 Labor??? they already did it, they explained it but is this normal?

 

Al, as mentioned the price they charged you was/is not really out of line for a dealer done stand alone FULL brake bleed on an EVO system..

 

What other service did they do for you? I do have a problem with a lot of dealers charging full price for the brake bleed if they already had the Tupperware off or the fuel tank removed for other service procedures..

 

When service procedures overlap on certain parts removal the cost to R & R the same parts or panels should be reflected in the overlapping service..

 

Twisty

[philbytx]

When service procedures overlap on certain parts removal the cost to R & R the same parts or panels should be reflected in the overlapping service..

Yeah right ...what planet have you been living on??? !!!

[tone1298]

I'm with Steve here. If you have the right tools and take your time, it's not too hard.

[KMG_365]

So Stan, where can I find the proper flushing technique since it is not in the Clymer manual? Does it really require the MoDiTec unit? Unfortunately, I do not know of anyone in my area with a similar RT, and I will not likely get away to a tech day, so I must rely on this forum and other written material or not do it myself at all.

Well, I'll be doing Maynard's brakes in the next few weeks--you're welcome to stop by! According to Google Maps I'm only 3100 miles away!

 

As far as the "new" service intervals go, I believe when the new R1200RT's came out with the stainless steel braided brake lines BMW said that the wheel circuits only needed to be bled every two years now. And of course they finally changed over to hydraulic oil in the clutch so you should never have to bleed the clutch on a R1200RT. And now the servos have gone away on the newest model of RT so they're back to the "simple" version the R1100 folks have been crowing about.