New type of Radar?

[Deadboy]

OK I have to ask the group as this has me stumped...is their some new form of radar out there? For the 3rd time recently I rode by a radar trailer that was flashing my speed (and seemed to be pretty accurate) and their was no reaction from my V-1 whatsoever....

 

What gives? I know it is working as I have in fact passed other radar trailers (and a motor officer who was using radar today) and it sets off the V-1....

 

Thanks........

[SageRider]

I don't know what is in use either. I have encountered one of these trailers on US95 in Beatty. The second unit was on US395 up in Oregon.

[Deadboy]

The one I saw today was in South Lake Tahoe (on 89) and the other one was in Coloma on highway 49....they set it up pretty regularly on 49 but the last 2 times it hasn't triggered the V-1....

[tbloomq]

OK I have to ask the group as this has me stumped...is their some new form of radar out there? For the 3rd time recently I rode by a radar trailer that was flashing my speed (and seemed to be pretty accurate) and their was no reaction from my V-1 whatsoever....

 

What gives? I know it is working as I have in fact passed other radar trailers (and a motor officer who was using radar today) and it sets off the V-1....

 

Thanks........

 

A little off topic, but has anyone else experienced the V1's going off while passing a highway traffic camera? The ones in the Bay area are using something that nails my V1 with a max signal.

 

Tom

[ESokoloff]

Ku band?

But not likely according to this.

 

According to Valentine current production V-1's are Ku capable but must be customer enabled.

[ghaverkamp]

A little off topic, but has anyone else experienced the V1's going off while passing a highway traffic camera? The ones in the Bay area are using something that nails my V1 with a max signal.

 

I think it's the traffic/travel time monitoring stuff that works in conjunction with the FasTrak.

[Deadboy]

Interesting......my V-1 is current according to their website.....the first time this happened I actually turned around and drove by the trailer again with the L (logic) feature turned off (I set it to A, as in no filter) and still nothing....Not sure why they would be introducing a new style out here in the boonies, if that is indeed the case...

 

Looks like their are plenty of models out there.

 

http://www.speedtrailers.net/

http://www.ru2systems.com/

 

 

[Les is more]

Are you getting other K band hits? You might want to download the manual and reset everything to make sure that all the bands are active. It could be that your K band is faulty in which case your detector needs to take a trip back to Valentine for a fix.

[smiller]

It could be that your K band is faulty in which case your detector needs to take a trip back to Valentine for a fix.

That would be my first guess too. Drive through a shopping area and you should get some K-band hits off of alarm systems. If you don't see any I would be suspicious of a problem...

[Deadboy]

Seems like I am...I rode very slowly past a motor officer yesterday who was in full speed trap mode on an overpass and got plenty of warning......I will re-read my owners manual and see if I can re-set the thing....

[smiller]

Weird. Let us know what you find out.

[Les is more]

The Motor Officer should be running KA. Most of the speed trailers run K band.

[Mike]

This is only a guess, but I believe that some of these signs now operate on non-police radar bands. I've had the same experience with my V-1s on a couple of occasions, and they're otherwise operating fine. In a way, it makes sense--the purpose of these signs is to actually have an effect on driver behavior, as opposed to . . . aaah, never mind.

[R4ND0M_AX3]

1. I wonder if they are switching to video like some of the intersections here in Roseville, CA.

 

2. Re: bay area radar near traffic cameras. Yes. I noticed that the last time I went to that area. My first reaction was that I'm surrounded. Then I started to suspect my V1. Finally I noticed the sensors on some light posts. Must be for the traffic speed info the news and other services use now.

[Bob_Minor]

Maybe there's a little guy in the trailer with a stopwatch.

[russell_bynum]

In a way, it makes sense--the purpose of these signs is to actually have an effect on driver behavior, as opposed to . . . aaah, never mind.

 

[Boffin]

This is only a guess, but I believe that some of these signs now operate on non-police radar bands. I've had the same experience with my V-1s on a couple of occasions, and they're otherwise operating fine. In a way, it makes sense--the purpose of these signs is to actually have an effect on driver behavior, as opposed to . . . aaah, never mind.

 

Although frequency allocations are made by each nation individually, Radar bands are very tightly controlled by international agreement to avoid comercial and safety issues - imagine a speed sign interfereing with an aircraft nav system. I can think of several possibilities - including use of newer high-frequency systems well above Ka - there are frequencies allocated to mobile radar right up to 300GHz (mind you my US allocation chart is about 2 years old now)

 

Andy

[PhillyFlash]

I had a problem where my V-1 stopped picking up Ka. A friend had his stop picking up K band. Everything else worked fine. Valentine is very good about service. Call and tell them about the problem. If they have you send it in, you'll usually get it back within a week or two. If it needs to be recalibrated, they may not even charge you (they didn't charge me). If you send it in, you may want to consider having it upgraded to the new POP system for a small fee, if you don't have that already.

[Tony_K]

I may be speaking out of my ass as I don't have a radar detector but could it be a laser?

 

We have a permently mounted box on a poll on a street in Pasadena. It's incredibly accurate and hits every car in its path. (single lane street)

I use it for calibration now.

 

So laser would be my bet.

Everything will be laser soon enough

[Deadboy]

Mine does detect lazer (and has the POP feature), and no it isn't that...and don't forget lazer only works when the sender is not moving, so it is pretty limited for a lot of applications...

 

I actually spoke with a CHP today about this and he said he has heard their are now lidar trailers being produced, so that may be what it is.....

 

FYI, I drove by a grocery store today and it went off (K band) as per normal....

 

So I just called Valentine 1 and they said there is something called Frequency Modulated Continuous Wave (FMCW) radar out there that is being used on trailers and is very difficult to detect. Apparently it is not accurate enough for ticketing purposes but works well in speed trailer applications....apparently they have been getting a number of calls about this recently...

[E30TECH]

Everything will be laser soon enough

 

You are right...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airborne_Laser

http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/abl.htm

[Deadboy]

Everything will be laser soon enough

 

You are right...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airborne_Laser

http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/abl.htm

 

Doubtful....If they start using AWAC's against speeders we have bigger problems to worry about....

[tobyzusa]

Any chance it is X-band and you have it shut off? I have x-band off (the audio) and got shot by a trooper in Fayetville, Arkansas using X. How sneaky is that. Luckily, as always, I was obeying all applicable traffic laws .

[motorman587]

Top secret, if I told you I would have to ...............

[Boffin]

So I just called Valentine 1 and they said there is something called Frequency Modulated Continuous Wave (FMCW) radar out there that is being used on trailers and is very difficult to detect. Apparently it is not accurate enough for ticketing purposes but works well in speed trailer applications....apparently they have been getting a number of calls about this recently...

 

All Valentine have to do to detect FMCW is put a PIN diode across the antenna and switch it at a jittered rate so as not to mess up pulse reception. That would make the FMCW look like a chirped pulse and it will be detected by the standard circuitry.

 

Andy

[russell_bynum]

All Valentine have to do to detect FMCW is put a PIN diode across the antenna and switch it at a jittered rate so as not to mess up pulse reception. That would make the FMCW look like a chirped pulse and it will be detected by the standard circuitry.

 

Andy

 

<hijack>Sometimes the level of know-how on this forum scares me.</hijack>

[bakerzdosen]

<hijack>Sometimes the level of know-how on this forum scares me.</hijack>

Nah, not me. Something has to balance out the lack of knowledge from people like me...

 

Thanks Nick for the update from Valentine. And here I thought that THIS was going to be my rationale for finally upgrading my 1.7 V1. Maybe one of these days...

[Redbrick]

One of those "tell ya' how fast you are goin'" trailers has been on 395 around Olancha for a while...Really triggers my Passport..Solid hits from a distance..And the laser goes off occasionally when near Edwards AFB and China Lake too....Secret laser weapons being tested by the military????

 

Phil........Redbrick

[SageRider]

"One of those "tell ya' how fast you are goin'" trailers has been on 395 around Olancha "

 

There are multiple stationary radar emitting signs on US395 in that area.

One of CHPs tricks is to park a cruiser with radar gun by a turned off sign. Gets all those who assume its just the sign.

 

The carts that are subject of this thread do not trigger any radar or laser alert in a fully functional detector.

[lawnchairboy]

Well then, I must be slap crazy cause they light up K-band consistently around me...(the cart-trailer thingies, that is...)

[Tasker]

I'm in central Indiana (Indianapolis).

 

Over the past few weeks, on my way to work in the morning, I've rounded the same curve on a six-lane interstate (three in each direction) to find either a motor-officer or an unmarked cruiser, with the officer standing next to his vehicle, pointing what seems to be a laser radar gun directly at cars approaching him. Two of the three times I've seen this happen, the car in the left lane (me in the middle lane) has been nailed and the trooper chased them down. During all three "events", my V-1 was not set off. All three times, I was at or near the speed limit. All three times my V-1 was set on the "A" (all bogeys) setting.

 

My V-1 is the latest version, which includes all bands and POP.

 

So, what is it? New radar?

 

And, here is a question: If two cars are running side-by-side, and the car on the left is pinged by a laser radar gun, is the laser beam so tightly focused that the V-1 in the car in the next lane on the right not be set off?

 

I know this for a fact: The cars on my immediate left were being pinged with something that was not setting off my V-1.

 

Not good...

[Boffin]

I'm in central Indiana (Indianapolis).

 

Over the past few weeks, on my way to work in the morning, I've rounded the same curve on a six-lane interstate (three in each direction) to find either a motor-officer or an unmarked cruiser, with the officer standing next to his vehicle, pointing what seems to be a laser radar gun directly at cars approaching him. Two of the three times I've seen this happen, the car in the left lane (me in the middle lane) has been nailed and the trooper chased them down. During all three "events", my V-1 was not set off. All three times, I was at or near the speed limit. All three times my V-1 was set on the "A" (all bogeys) setting.

 

My V-1 is the latest version, which includes all bands and POP.

 

So, what is it? New radar?

 

And, here is a question: If two cars are running side-by-side, and the car on the left is pinged by a laser radar gun, is the laser beam so tightly focused that the V-1 in the car in the next lane on the right not be set off?

 

I know this for a fact: The cars on my immediate left were being pinged with something that was not setting off my V-1.

 

Not good...

 

Laser detectors are instant-on and have a beam about 2ft in diameter at a quarter of a mile. They could ping your left-hand headlight and a detector on your dash may not see it.

 

Andy

[bewareofdoug]

Radar is nothing compared to what the British are doing. Sensors in the road and photo ticket. No way to detect sensors until you have passed over them. One town went from about 6,0000 pounds of fines a year to over 3,000,000 pounds a year of "income" The new Jaguars have a speed button that you can activate that will not allow the car to go over a set speed.

Doug

[smiller]

And, here is a question: If two cars are running side-by-side, and the car on the left is pinged by a laser radar gun, is the laser beam so tightly focused that the V-1 in the car in the next lane on the right not be set off?

Yes, I believe that's quite possible. A lidar detector counts on receiving reflections off of another vehicle, or an erroneous shake of the lidar gun (that momentarily paints your vehicle) while targeting another vehicle, or perhaps by an attempt to read your speed before you are within proper range. So alerts are possible if you are in a pack of vehicles that all being scanned by the lidar gun, but a good, clean hit out of nowhere and you're probably toast. About all you can do on a bike is make sure that your detector is as close as possible to the headlight (the most likely aiming point), keep an careful eye out (always an important part of radar/lidar detector technique), and hope for the best.

 

FWIW I and a few others around here share a number of experiences where a lidar alert was effective in avoiding a possible violation, but at the same time none of us consider a lidar detector to be anything more than a tool to assist an already watchful eye.

[mefly2]

All Valentine have to do to detect FMCW is put a PIN diode across the antenna and switch it at a jittered rate so as not to mess up pulse reception. That would make the FMCW look like a chirped pulse and it will be detected by the standard circuitry.

 

Andy

Incredible knowledge base ... this is the site!

[pismopal]

Maybe this has been addressed so excuse my big mouth. Radar is accurate but it's ability for selection of targets is limiting in the traffic enforcement scenario. Radar(radio) goes out in an expanding wave and the first target to get the wave sends back a bounce and that is what the gun reads. If you are behind the first bounce and going even faster..the first target is it...so to speak. Laser is light and is not an expanding wave so it can be directed by the operator to pick out a faster moving target which is "hidden" in the flow of traffic from the traditional radar gun. California is blessed or cursed by the fact that there is very little traffic enforcement..radar or otherwise, especially on the major traffic ways. Uh..we can talk.

[BailyD]

Strange you should mention this. I stopped a man the other day for speeding and he asked me how I got him. I told him I used my radar. He told me I couldn't have because his radar detector didn't go off. I told him he should get a better radar detector.

 

We use Ka band, constant run or instant on. He was tracked with instant on. I believe our speed trailers are also Ka band.

 

Radar can be influenced by the largest, closest or fastest vehicle. Newer units have multiple screens which can display a target being tracked and the fastest target approaching. Its up to the operator to properly identify the target vehicle. They are also directional sensitve and can track vehicles while the patrol car is moving in the same direction as the target vehicle. It may be approaching the moving patrol car from behind (same direction) or be traveling ahead of the moving patrol car (same direction)

 

Sorry John, I'm not trying to give away our secrets I just want to help educate the motoring public.

[johnt650]

I had a similar experience during my traveling days wih a SC Highway patrolman. My V1 did not go off and he said he was using radar. He was nice enough to turn the unit on for me to check my detector and the K-band was dead. Over the years I think I've had a problem with a band twice.

[Ken H.]

Probably not what you encountered, but there is a new speed monitoring technology out that takes two high speed digital photographs of the vehicle then calculates the vehicle's speed based on the position of the vehicle in the two photos and the time between when they where taken. 10 ms or so. Totally passive, totally undetectable.

[BailyD]

The photo speed sensor sounds like an updated form of VASCAR.

[OldMotor]

Seems like I am...I rode very slowly past a motor officer yesterday who was in full speed trap mode on an overpass and got plenty of warning......I will re-read my owners manual and see if I can re-set the thing....

 

How is this a speed trap and where was this?