Is there space to Fit a Stebel Nautilus Horn to an R1200RT?

[RoSPA_man]

Hi

I'm waiting for my R1200RT. In the meantime, has anyone actually fitted a Stebel NAutilus Compact to an RT - is there natural space where the original horn is?

Thanks

[paulcbrowne]

Just installed mine today. It went in more easily than I had expected. It easily clears the spring and the fork tubes. I removed the original horn and both parts of its bracket. Next, I took some flat stock and drilled two holes about 1/2 as far apart as the original horn bracket (the straight part). I bolted the new bracket to the frame where the original had attached. I used the Stebel bolt mount and added a couple of industrial strength cable ties to hold the front of the horn up to the frame. You have to check and move the horn a bit to avoid the from brake line. Not a big deal. I used the horn wires to trigger a relay that supplies power from an accessory fuse block.

 

(Before anyone asks, I forgot to take a picture before buttoning everything up again.)

[RoSPA_man]

Thanks

That's great to know that it fits - are you plesed with the sound?

 

When you mention wires, I started to wonder why a horn has 2 wires- most items on a bike are grounded with only a single wire carrying the the live supply. Hugh

[Boffin]

Thanks

That's great to know that it fits - are you plesed with the sound?

 

When you mention wires, I started to wonder why a horn has 2 wires- most items on a bike are grounded with only a single wire carrying the the live supply. Hugh

 

That's normal practice for horns. The horn switch grounds one wire, the other goes to the supply.

 

Andy

[RoSPA_man]

Thanks Paul

Great description- thanks. Out of curiosity, presumably you simply attached the 2 existing wires to the coil circuit of the relay up at the front - ie you did not position the relay back near the battery etc . Did you then run (fused)+ power direct to horn and get the relay to make and break the grounding (-) part of the horn main circuit? I assume the relay doesn't care whether it is switching + or - part of the circuit. One other thing- did you use a Stebel supplied relay and if so, does it have/does it need a diode to protect against surges - I have read that when the coil in the relay is de-energised, it can fire back up to 200V and that a diode will mop this surge up - see http://www.angelfire.com/ab6/userper/relays.htm for a typical good explanation of relays. Finally, I believe that this may not be necesaary as the original switch on the 1200RT operates a relay which is diode protected so maybe that removes the need for one on the Stebel relay. Hope that makes sense - and thanks again

Why do I always type "relay" as "realy" -damn muscle memory

BW

Hugh

[Boffin]

Finally, I believe that this may not be necesaary as the original switch on the 1200RT operates a relay which is diode protected so maybe that removes the need for one on the Stebel relay.

 

I would have a diode across every relay. As the relay coil is de-energised by being switched off, the collapsing magnetic field generates a high-voltage spike in the opposite sense of the energising voltage (+ and - reversed). This spike can cause quite a bit of damage to the electronics on the bike - even if not connected to the same circuit.

 

Andy

[markprice]

This is the first I've ever heard of putting a diode in to stop a spike due to collapsing fields. What value diode?

Mark

[Boffin]

This is the first I've ever heard of putting a diode in to stop a spike due to collapsing fields. What value diode?

Mark

 

A fast recovery diode of about 1 amp capacity, such as a 1N4933 or 1N4934 would do fine.

 

Andy

[markprice]

Boffin , So the diode is put in series in the 12+ line? Where would one get a diode like this?

Mark

[RoSPA_man]

Boffin , So the diode is put in series in the 12+ line? Where would one get a diode like this?

Mark

As I understnd it, it goes across the coil terminals (Bosch 85&86) and you need to be careful of polarity. There is a thread that has a photo of a diode soldered externally directly across somehwere but I can't find it right now

Hugh

[99Roadster]

Radio Shack should have this. It's a very common component.

 

As mentioned be careful of polarity. There is a line around the diode indicating direction of current flow. Think of the line as a pointing arrow. ---> The current should only flow away from the source - that's what a diode does, in this case it prevents the current from going the other way.

[BucksTherapy]

I found a great article on how this works and the resulting voltage fluctuations.

 

http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/appnotes/app_pdfs/13c3264.pdf

 

I have been playing with auto elextronics for more years then I can remember and didn't know this. I'll definitely be adding a diode across the coils of any future relays I use.

 

This site is very informative.

[Boffin]

Boffin , So the diode is put in series in the 12+ line? Where would one get a diode like this?

Mark

As I understnd it, it goes across the coil terminals (Bosch 85&86) and you need to be careful of polarity. There is a thread that has a photo of a diode soldered externally directly across somehwere but I can't find it right now

Hugh

 

Yes the diode goes across the coil terminals in reverse polarity, that is with the marked end on +12V and the unmarked end on ground. This makes sure no current goes through the diode normally but it snubs the reverse current caused by the switch off.

 

Andy

[paulcbrowne]

I used a Bosch relay and mounted it just above & forward of the battery -- you need to take off all of one side's Tupperware to get at it, but it's safe. I also cut a bicycle inner tube and slipped it over the relay. I used the original horn wires to trigger the relay and have a power supply from an accessory fuse block that I installed. The only problem that I found was that the horn needs a 20 amp fuse. That makes me a bit uncomfortable, but I think it's the compressor start up that needs the amperage.

 

Sound -- it's great!! Of course, I had had one on my GS and have one in my Subaru Outback. I once scared the heck out of a Boss Hoss rider with it -- if that's a reasobale testimonial.

[RoSPA_man]

I used a Bosch relay and mounted it just above & forward of the battery -- you need to take off all of one side's Tupperware to get at it, but it's safe. I also cut a bicycle inner tube and slipped it over the relay. I used the original horn wires to trigger the relay and have a power supply from an accessory fuse block that I installed. The only problem that I found was that the horn needs a 20 amp fuse. That makes me a bit uncomfortable, but I think it's the compressor start up that needs the amperage.

 

Sound -- it's great!! Of course, I had had one on my GS and have one in my Subaru Outback. I once scared the heck out of a Boss Hoss rider with it -- if that's a reasobale testimonial.

 

Do you mean you mounted the relay near the battery or the horn near the battery, or did you put the horn where th eoriginal horn was??

[moshe_levy]

Hi All-

 

My recent post shows the diode across the 12 VDC 30A relay included with the Stebel horn. See http://www.mklsportster.com/r1150rthorn.htm

 

-MKL

[RoSPA_man]

Hi All-

 

My recent post shows the diode across the 12 VDC 30A relay included with the Stebel horn. See http://www.mklsportster.com/r1150rthorn.htm

 

-MKL

 

Did you use the relay to complete the ground circuit or the live +12V circuit. I am assuming it would be better to run the +12V (fused) direct to the horn from the battery and to use the relay switch to complete the circuit to ground, ie relay connector 30 grounded and 87 to (-) horn - or does it matter?

The other question is - is the diode small enough not to upset the seting of the relay into its socket - or did you use a relay socket at all? Guess it just takes up space for no gain?

[moshe_levy]

>>>>Did you use the relay to complete the ground circuit or the live +12V circuit.<<<<

 

Live. Ground is run direct from the negative terminal of the air horn compressor to the battery negative, as I did it.

 

>>>>I am assuming it would be better to run the +12V (fused) direct to the horn from the battery and to use the relay switch to complete the circuit to ground, ie relay connector 30 grounded and 87 to (-) horn - or does it matter?<<<<

 

All this might be moot. I have an older model ('04) and I'm not sure about the Hexheads, but my bike already has a relay with diode installed on the stock wiring harness for the stock horn. If all you're doing is installing one Stebel, you don't really need to bother installing an additional relay. The only advantage to doing so is being able to run power directly from the battery via some nice thick 12 gauge wire instead of triggering the horn from (in my bike's case) meager 18 gauge wire. You might get a few more decibels out of the horn by powering direct from battery, but it's not REALLY necessary by any means.

 

>>>>The other question is - is the diode small enough not to upset the seting of the relay into its socket - or did you use a relay socket at all? Guess it just takes up space for no gain?<<<<

 

Again, check to see if your bike already has a relay and diode, like my '04 does. In my case, my article descibed my connections and I used all terminals on the relay as I mentioned. The diode does not interfere with any connections at all. It is soldered around the base of the terminals, where the lugs don't reach anyway.

 

-MKL

[RoSPA_man]

To draw all this together, is the attached diagram correct?

[moshe_levy]

I'm not sure that diagram is correct. There is a schematic in the instructions to follow by the way, so no need to make too much out of this. It's easy.

 

Essentially, the power from the original horn wires goes to the coil terminals of the relay. The + wire goes in the same side terminal as striped side of the diode, which is soldered across the coil terminals of the relay. Power from the battery is then brought into one of the 2 remaining terminals on the relay - doesn't matter which one. An inline fuse on that power line is a good idea. The last terminal on the relay then feeds the 12 VDC to the + terminal of the horn. The - terminal of the horn goes directly to the - terminal of the battery for ground. That'a about all there is to it.

 

-MKL

[moshe_levy]

SOrry, forgot to post the cheesy drawing Stebel has online showing connections. It might help you visualize this. See http://www.stebel.it/stebel/NAUTILUS-COMPACT.pdf

 

-MKL

[RoSPA_man]

I'm not sure that diagram is correct. There is a schematic in the instructions to follow by the way, so no need to make too much out of this. It's easy.

 

Essentially, the power from the original horn wires goes to the coil terminals of the relay. The + wire goes in the same side terminal as striped side of the diode, which is soldered across the coil terminals of the relay. Power from the battery is then brought into one of the 2 remaining terminals on the relay - doesn't matter which one. An inline fuse on that power line is a good idea. The last terminal on the relay then feeds the 12 VDC to the + terminal of the horn. The - terminal of the horn goes directly to the - terminal of the battery for ground. That'a about all there is to it.

 

-MKL

 

Thanks Moshe

I agree it's easy but I'm just interested in general in best practice- 2 things- wouldn't it be better to just have one power wire direct to the horn so that it eliminates the possibility of a live short i.e if thee are several potential places where a live lead could ground out (I know it makes no difference which you switch otherwise) and my other question is why do you need to ground right back to the battery- can you not just ground to any suitable/nearest point on the bike? I know that any point will work but is there any reason to run a long wire back - again I stress just a general best practice question.

Thanks for all the help

BW

Hugh

[onedae]

I'm installing the Stebel today and wonder whether I can ditch the OEM horn without triggering a fault with the Canbus system. I planned on removing the OEM horn completely and using the OEM wires to trigger everything.

I read a thread on another board that suggested that removing the OEM horn might cause a Canbus issue - anyone know?

[Ken H.]

I'm installing the Stebel today and wonder whether I can ditch the OEM horn without triggering a fault with the Canbus system. I planned on removing the OEM horn completely and using the OEM wires to trigger everything.

I read a thread on another board that suggested that removing the OEM horn might cause a Canbus issue - anyone know?

No issues. Mine's been gone for a year.

[RoSPA_man]

Just installed mine today. It went in more easily than I had expected. It easily clears the spring and the fork tubes. I removed the original horn and both parts of its bracket. Next, I took some flat stock and drilled two holes about 1/2 as far apart as the original horn bracket (the straight part). I bolted the new bracket to the frame where the original had attached. I used the Stebel bolt mount and added a couple of industrial strength cable ties to hold the front of the horn up to the frame. You have to check and move the horn a bit to avoid the from brake line. Not a big deal. I used the horn wires to trigger a relay that supplies power from an accessory fuse block.

 

(Before anyone asks, I forgot to take a picture before buttoning everything up again.)

 

Lucky you- I tried mounting on my 2 day old RT- admittedly I was worrying about breaking things more than the job itself- I gave up after trying for an hour to clear the forks and (lessof a poblem) the brake lines and refitted the wispy horn! It looked like lots of space, but proved tricky. The Stebel has an irritaing bolting setup. Did you bolt th ebracket to the top side and not bend it? Did you use a straight new half size bracket and just mount the half size bracket you describe to the frame without the second brackety bit? Also how did you run the wires- without removing the tank or its tupperware it looked fairly dense in there. Does the 1200 tank move enough with disconnecting any fuel lines to allow threading of the wires back to the battery? I intend to heat shrink 2 heavy gauge and 2 light gauge wires into one "loom" for tidiness sake. Anyway, I put my failure down more to early day nerves working on a pristine machine andI will try again shortly, this time having made up a bracket in advance. Thanks

[AZRTRDR]

I got tired of messing with the Stebel and just bought the dual horn setup for $86 from my dealer.

The wiring harness for the duals is still there it's just that the bikes were not ordered with that option.

Now I have the factory duals, as I had on my 05, and no problems.

If you guys are thinking of ordering a new bike just add the dual horn option. That gnat's fart horn can get you killed.

[Rocket_Cowboy]

I got tired of messing with the Stebel and just bought the dual horn setup for $86 from my dealer.

 

Got a part number to go with that? I've got a Stebel sitting in a box that I haven't even started to attempt to work on ... but if there's an easy option that bolts into the stock harness ... that's got my name on it.

[AZRTRDR]

Sorry, but no I don't.

The dealer should have no problem finding it, 2 horns one high and one low. 2 bolts and 2 panel nuts.

Just adding the low tone horn in place of the stock "gnat fart" one makes a significant difference.

Sorry about the " no part #" thing.

[Rocket_Cowboy]

No worries Tim, I had to ask.

 

I'll give my dealer a buzz once I'm back in town and let him track down the details. Thanks for the info though!

[RoSPA_man]

Just installed mine today. It went in more easily than I had expected. It easily clears the spring and the fork tubes. I removed the original horn and both parts of its bracket. Next, I took some flat stock and drilled two holes about 1/2 as far apart as the original horn bracket (the straight part). I bolted the new bracket to the frame where the original had attached. I used the Stebel bolt mount and added a couple of industrial strength cable ties to hold the front of the horn up to the frame. You have to check and move the horn a bit to avoid the from brake line. Not a big deal. I used the horn wires to trigger a relay that supplies power from an accessory fuse block.

 

(Before anyone asks, I forgot to take a picture before buttoning everything up again.)

 

Following up on an old post, I now have the bike, have twice tried to fit the horn and I would really appreciate a photo if possible as it seems really difficult / impossible without fouling something. I removed the old horn and although there appears to be lots of space, there really isn't.

 

The other suggestion made to me was to use a stock K1200LT horn which bolts straight in and apparaently does a reasonable imitation of a dual tone.

[NursePeter]

Hi all... Sorry to sound a little special here on my first post (I'll blame it on just finishing night shift at the Emergency Dept).... is everyone talking about adding two Dual Stebel Compact Nautilus Air Horns or am I just getting confused with the fact that one horn is making a dual tone?

[Ken H.]

One horn makes a dual tone.