Oh ..no: UPS "Drop" shipped my just repaired tranny!

[SWB]

After 3 months of waiting, I finally received my repaired transmission via UPS. The box looked OK, but when I opened it, the transmission came out in three parts instead of one (see photos). The upper corner of the case was broken. I suspect that one or more UPS drivers missed the signs on all for sides which said "FRAGILE!!", and dropped it off a loading dock. It was double boxed, and well packed within the second box.

 

Anyone know if (1) this damage is repairable by brazing or welding (cast aluminum?), (2) repairable without disassembly, or if (3) this is essential to the operation of the transmission or construction/assembly of the bike.

 

I haven't tried to position it on the bike yet. I just opened the box, saw the damage, threw-up, cried like a baby, and then ran for the beer in the ice box. I also wrote the shipper and asked him to file a claim with UPS. We'll see how that works out; the goal was to get my bike back together, not collect settlements.

 

 

[Firefight911]

Make sure you retain ALL the packing materials that were with/in/around the box/transmission.

 

Sorry to hear that after the long wait you have to deal with this.

 

Not really able to tell whether the case is compromised as I don't have teh experience, but it does appear to be strengthening ribs where the break is.

 

I would file the claim and insist on immediate resolution at the shipper's expense, regardless.

 

I would do some leg work to help expedite your claim. Get a cost on replacing the case along with all associated labor, etc. to do the case swap. I would also get a quote for a new transmission.

 

Show your willingness to work with the insurance claim but be insistent on finding a resolution that is as expeditious as possible with some compensation to your lack of consortium, err, loss of use of your bike.

 

Good luck and let us know the outcome!

[EffBee]

It's been my experience that UPS will deny your claim. Doesn't matter if five employees signed the box with "we did it on purpose," they will deny it. They'll claim that it wasn't properly packaged, that the contents weren't properly protected. It's just their SOP. They hope you don't have much experience with them and just take their decision and go away.

 

You will have to fight them. Once you do, they suddenly become much more reasonable. I hope you had it insured for full replacement value, including labor. Don't let them get away with just buying you a replacement case. It'll cost you several hundred more to have the internals moved to the new case. You need to be made whole. And that means a new, or completely rebuilt transmission, just like the one they broke.

[Carnadero]

Question: what's the approximate weight of the unit?

[SWB]

Question: what's the approximate weight of the unit?

 

I think it said 45 lbs. It's actually pretty light, considering it's a BMW transmission. I've heard "JB WELD" as a suggestion, but I'm afraid the vibration would shake it lose. Seems like it's not a structural component, but with a brittle cast metal case, who knows.

 

Filed a claim with UPS, and know that they almost never pay a claim. I should have specified the shipper; I hate trusting UPS more than the Post Office.

[Bill_Walker]

Criminy, man, if you didn't have bad luck, you wouldn't have any luck at all!

 

Is there a sign near your house that says "Entering SWB Zone. Murphy's Law Strictly Enforced"?

 

I feel for you. Really.

[jfremder]

I broke the 'fin' off the bottom of the cast aluminum lower unit on a small outboard motor. I was able to have it repaired at a local welder for $25. He didn't even drain the gear oil. While it wasn't a pretty repair, it's plenty strong, and has been banging rocks ever since. Might be an option to get you up and running, you can keep the settlement for fuel $$$'s

[mikefigielski]

Actually, We've had several claims with UPS and they've paid every one of them with minimal hassle. Fed Ex on the other hand was terrible, thus the switch to UPS for us. The Post office is the worst in my opininon as far as paying claims, almost useless. I would try to collect the claim and then have the fin welded or JB welded back on. It really should not effect the integrity of the trans. Hope this helps.

Mike

[Dan Gleebitz]

Looking at the construction I would say from these photos that the flange in question was in free air and probably doesn't add anything to the boxes regidity. No doubt when you put it back together you will be able to reaffirm this. It could be repairable with the liquid metal referred to in this thread.

 

This repair should only be undertaken if you cannot get a new / repaired box out of UPS.

[Ken H.]

Obviously try to get a claim paid and all that stuff, but if in the end you're stuck with it, I don't think that broken off piece of the casting is a show stopper. If there are no cracks emanating from the location to elsewhere in the case, I'd put it in and ride it.

[smiller]

Obviously try to get a claim paid and all that stuff, but if in the end you're stuck with it, I don't think that broken off piece of the casting is a show stopper. If there are no cracks emanating from the location to elsewhere in the case, I'd put it in and ride it.

+1

 

I'd be pretty ticked off about it too, but functionally there shouldn't be any negative effect. And for cosmetic purposes, even JB Weld would probably make a quite adequate repair.

[Gail]

Please, please, please, NO JB Weld!!. I’ve repaired many damaged aluminum castings such as your transmission over the years. From your pictures, it doesn’t look like it will be any problem the have the Tig welded. It’s open air (meaning the broken piece doesn’t reach into the oil containment area of the case) and it appears to be very accessible. A good Tig welder shouldn’t have any problem taking care of it with out splitting the cases. Please do not try to JB weld, glue, or any adhesive to make the repair. If you do and it doesn’t work out, you have really complicated the welding process. Aluminum castings are very porous and the binding agents in glues get trapped in the pores of the casting and they are next to impossible to get out. The heat of the welding process causes the binding agents gasify and that causes contamination of the weld zone.

 

I see you’re in Ocean Side California; you should have no problem finding a high class Tig welder. I would check out some of the local high performance (speed shops) in your area. There are a lot of hot shot welders lurking around those places.

 

It’s too bad this has happened, but chin up, it’s not a big deal to get repaired.

 

 

Gail

[NoHeat]

It is broken very near a bolt hole. Webbing that supports the bolt hole passage is now missing.

 

This might compromise your ability to tighten the bolt to the required torque without further damage.

 

To find out whether the problem is significant. I suggest performing a test of the bolt tightening. You could probably do this on the bench, by bolting the suspect part of the transmission to a thick metal plate that is drilled with a hole the same diameter.

 

There's no point in using glue. If it is to be repaired, it should be able to withstand some serious stress when that bolt is tightened, otherwise you're just making a decorative repair.

 

[smiller]

In this case I think all you really need is a decorative repair as the transmission mounting bolts are holding two machined and very mutually supportive surfaces together and I don't think that there is a lot of stress there. Surprisingly, the torque spec for these bolts isn't even all that high.

 

Re: JB Weld, I know many despise it but it does have its applications. I suppose that it might be preferable to physically weld if you can find someone who can do the weld without doing more harm than good, both to the appearance of the case and the transmission itself (I'd personally have more than a casual concern for what the heat might do to the still bolted-together cases and internals and if it were me if I'd definitely pull the cover before going at it with a welder, but then again I've done that so many times I could do it in my sleep...). It's just a matter of picking the least of all evils based on your own past experience, and I guess that varies.

[Smoky]

I'd file it smooth, shoot some black paint on it, bolt it in and go riding.

 

And I wouldn't tell anybody!

[AviP]

I also wrote the shipper and asked him to file a claim with UPS.

I filed a claim with UPS for just $20 (it was a matter of principle). Initially they postured and claimed that the item was not packaged properly since it was listed as "Your packaging". But finally they relented because it was not worth it to drive to the delivery destination and have it checked out.

 

In your case the item is much more costlier and so they will beat you over the head with a stick. Keep all the packaging. "FRAGILE" stickers are a joke because nobody gives a sh1t about it. If the tranny was not properly packaged in a framed box(?) at the minimum, you can forget your claim.

 

Best of luck!

[SWB]

In your case the item is much more costlier and so they will beat you over the head with a stick. Keep all the packaging. "FRAGILE" stickers are a joke because nobody gives a sh1t about it. If the tranny was not properly packaged in a framed box(?) at the minimum, you can forget your claim.

 

I got feedback that packages insured for over $1200 are supposed to be personally handled by a UPS supervisor. This one was obviously not, and probably fell of a conveyor 20 feet up in a UPS transit warehouse. They can fault my packaging all that want, but I'll ask them about their handling policies.

 

Thanks..

[SWB]

Obviously try to get a claim paid and all that stuff, but if in the end you're stuck with it, I don't think that broken off piece of the casting is a show stopper. If there are no cracks emanating from the location to elsewhere in the case, I'd put it in and ride it.

 

I think it's probably cosmetic, but I don't know how hard this thing was dropped. Could there be internal damage; not likely. On the other hand, if my transmission dies in 5000 miles because of hidden damage, then I'm stuck. Plus, there's the resale value; how do I convince a buyer that this bike wasn't wrecked, when there's damage down to the transmission?

 

I think I'll go the TIG route, after the claim is paid.

[SWB]

I'd file it smooth, shoot some black paint on it, bolt it in and go riding.

 

And I wouldn't tell anybody!

 

lol. I like simple solutions. I won't see it when I ride.

[SWB]

Criminy, man, if you didn't have bad luck, you wouldn't have any luck at all!

 

Is there a sign near your house that says "Entering SWB Zone. Murphy's Law Strictly Enforced"?

 

I feel for you. Really.

 

Well.... it was just my turn. So was last time, and the time before last, and ....

[SWB]

Actually, We've had several claims with UPS and they've paid every one of them with minimal hassle. Fed Ex on the other hand was terrible, thus the switch to UPS for us. The Post office is the worst in my opininon as far as paying claims, almost useless. I would try to collect the claim and then have the fin welded or JB welded back on. It really should not effect the integrity of the trans. Hope this helps.

 

Thanks Mike. I was actually thinking of just scraping it out to your yard for $25. Freshly rebuilt, all gears undercut, better than new, but it's not "perfect", so I'm dumping it.

 

I've had a lot of luck shipping DHL lately. UPS used to be good, and FEDEX was the gold standard. It probably depends on the regional office, how well the terminals are run in any particular geographic location.

[nrp]

FWIW My .02Cent opinion -

 

TIG weld the parts together - but first make sure the existing machined surface is still flat within say .003 if you can. I'll bet you can very likely salvage it as it looks to me like it is only a cosmetic feature that was broken off.

 

Pocket any settlement money.

[Jerry Johnston]

In your 2nd photo part of the break looks old? Maybe cracked on the way to repair?

[Mulepick]

Someone always comes up with a theory on how something like this will cause problems. Even the far out speculation keeps you wondering in the back of your mind. Don't worry about this. Really. TIG it for cosmetics, shoot it black and be done, or make some chrome louvers for it and we'll all want a hole!

 

Bob

[Eckhard Grohe]

Comparing with the other side it looks like a closeout piece that butts up another bit somewhere. Doesn't look structural at all. JB weld it in place and paint black.

 

If you really want to be thorough buy a crack detector kit and check for cracks. McMaster Carr, Visible Dye-Penetrant Kit 1383T3 Each $96.06.

 

Keep after UPS nonetheless.

[SWB]

In your 2nd photo part of the break looks old? Maybe cracked on the way to repair?

 

Fresh break: I shipped it disassembled, and the shop told me that it was the best packing job they'd seen. Came repacked in the original box, double boxed with a second. It happened in transit back.

[SWB]

Comparing with the other side it looks like a closeout piece that butts up another bit somewhere. Doesn't look structural at all. JB weld it in place and paint black.

 

If you really want to be thorough buy a crack detector kit and check for cracks. McMaster Carr, Visible Dye-Penetrant Kit 1383T3 Each $96.06.

 

Keep after UPS nonetheless.

 

That might be an idea; I'm more concerned with potential hidden damage than the cosmetic damage.

 

The kicker is, UPS showed up at our door today unannounced "to pick up the box". Tranny and packing material was sitting on the garage floor, unpackaged. My wife called me, and I asked the guy what UPS was going to do with the transmission? He said he didn't know ..he was just the route driver, and had orders to pick it up. I asked to have the pickup rescheduled, and have a supervisor call.

 

First my tranmission breaks. Three months later it's finally fixed, for a small fortune in cost. It arrives with a damage case. Now the breakee wants to pick it up and take it away, with no commitment otherwise. I'm supposed to hand a UPS driver a $3000 transmission.. and "here ya go bud, ya have fun with that now..."

 

Uhh...no, no thank you, not today thank you.

 

I know now that I should have just parted this bike out and bought a new (or late model) RT. Live and learn.

[dbenson]

I spent a couple minutes studying your photos. Looks like the section that fractured off isn't structural. The buttress that connects to the bolt hole is meant to reinforce the section that snapped off, not the bolt hole itself.

 

If you were filling a hole or a void, I'd go with the metal-filled epoxy(JBweld). This is a common technique for repairing cast aluminum engine blocks and cylinder heads.

 

Since this is an exposed thin section, not a hole, I'll second the recommendations that you have this welded by an experienced TIG welder. Again, these professionals aren't too hard to find. A repair of this type shouldn't be expensive. Don't do anything to the pieces or the fracture surface before you have the weld repair performed. As someone else mentioned, anything you do is likely to complicate welding the loose pieces back on.

 

I would recommend having the repair made, for the simple reason that there is a secondary fracture visible on the case. It's possible, although unlikely, that this crack could enlarge if it's not sealed shut; depending on how the part is stressed during use. Even a incomplete repair(not replacing the loose pieces) that fuses this crack shut, would be prudent.

 

TIG welding is very precise, and the temperature required to weld aluminum is relatively low. I think it very likely that the repair could be made with the transmission still assembled.

 

Once repaired, a little black paint and you'll never have to worry about it, or be able to see it, again.

[skyskier]

Scott, first let me say "THAT SUCKS". Next +1 on the tig weld. It will be stronger that it was before it broke. A friend of mine had the tensioner pulley for the serpentine belt on his suburban snap in half (it's aluminum). It was a Sunday and no place to get a new part, we were in Parker Az. An old guy at a junk yard says “hey, I got a TIG welder in the back, I can fix it.” Well my friend was stuck so what the hack we let him weld it. My friend says, “I put on a new one when I get home.” It’s still on his daily driver truck today, 3 years later. TIG it.

[RFW]

Looking at the construction I would say from these photos that the flange in question was in free air and probably doesn't add anything to the boxes regidity. No doubt when you put it back together you will be able to reaffirm this. It could be repairable with the liquid metal referred to in this thread.

I have used epoxy adhesives 40 years. The so-called "liquid metal" or "JB Weld" is simply epoxy with powdered steel or aluminum mixed in. From experience, I can tell you that it hasn't the slightest hope of standing up to the vibration and temperature stresses the transmission is subjected to. You would be gluing only the edge of the broken parts together. There isn't enough surface area to effect a useful bond under the conditions it will be used.

 

Don't even bother! It will fail in short order.

[SWB]

Scott, first let me say "THAT SUCKS". Next +1 on the tig weld. It will be stronger that it was before it broke. A friend of mine had the tensioner pulley for the serpentine belt on his suburban snap in half (it's aluminum). It was a Sunday and no place to get a new part, we were in Parker Az. An old guy at a junk yard says “hey, I got a TIG welder in the back, I can fix it.” Well my friend was stuck so what the hack we let him weld it. My friend says, “I put on a new one when I get home.” It’s still on his daily driver truck today, 3 years later. TIG it.

 

Thanks for the tip(s) (all of you guys). I've been waiting for 3 months to get my ride back together, and I'm tired of dickering with UPS, so I'm just going to eat the damage, and take it to a shop to have it welded. Unfortunately, I'm working 7 days/70+ hrs a week right now, so I'm not getting anything done on the bike; can't even get the tranny over to a shop. Seems that I have money and no time, or time and no money, but never the both together (well...sometimes no time and no money .. ).

[SWB]

Well, got some recommendations from a couple of shops, and took the transmission to a specialty machine shop. The welder there took one look at the chips, and said it couldn't be welded. He ran a test to make certain, but the metal doesn't melt, it burns. He believes that the transmission case is probably made from a magnesium alloy, or other lightweight engineered metal.

 

So, I'm going to drill a hole at the base of the fissure to keep the crack from spreading, and plug the hole and reassemble the cracked pieces with JB Weld. I'll strip the paint off the flange area, and backfill behind it with JB Weld in coats to build strength across the damaged flange.

 

I'm as skeptical as anyone that the repair will hold up, but if there's no further crackcing or flaking, the cosmentic appearance won't matter much. Short of rebuilding the transmission again in an new case, this is the next best alternative. I can always try grinding down with area with a dremel if the chipped part falls off.

 

I'll post some pix when done. So much hassle because of a lazy or irresponsible UPS driver.

[Godfather]

I am amazed that you are not able to get any satisfaction from UPS! As much as I am against litigation, there is a time and place for it. They are at fault and should accept responsibility. Are there any lawyers on this board that may want to help out a fellow rider just because it would be the right thing to do?

[SWB]

I am amazed that you are not able to get any satisfaction from UPS! As much as I am against litigation, there is a time and place for it. They are at fault and should accept responsibility. Are there any lawyers on this board that may want to help out a fellow rider just because it would be the right thing to do?

 

UPS came by to pick up the transmission for inspection, but could not tell me when or if I'd get it back again, or how they'd effect the repairs. Once it left my garage, the issue was between them and the shipper. Moreover, it was already out of the box(es). Rather than photograph or inspect and the packing material on site, we would have to repack it as it was originally packed. If USP didn't like the way we repacked it, they'd reject the claim. We did repack it, but I decided that I didn't want to let UPS have the transmission. I don't trust them to handle the transmission or settle the claim in a timely manner.

 

It'd be a different issue of the damage was more than cosmetic; I'd be more aggressive with UPS. But at this point, my bike's been spread across the garage for 3 months, and I just want to get it back together.

 

Hope I'm not making a mistake; wouldn't be the first time.

[smiller]

I'm as skeptical as anyone that the repair will hold up

If your technique in mixing/applying the epoxy is correct then the repair should actually be quite solid.

[Tony_K]

Well, got some recommendations from a couple of shops, and took the transmission to a specialty machine shop. The welder there took one look at the chips, and said it couldn't be welded. He ran a test to make certain, but the metal doesn't melt, it burns. He believes that the transmission case is probably made from a magnesium alloy, or other lightweight engineered metal.

 

Wow! I guess the guy you took it to has never heard of a car company that made silly little cars for say um 50+ years with magnesium cases!

 

Um Volkswagen... I think you may have heard of them and yes magnesium can be welded. It's done all the time in our drag racing circle.

 

Sorry your going though all these hassles. Just snap the puppy back together and ROLL!

[bartster]

Tig welding is only part of the process, Tig welding is short for tungsten inert gas, you will need a high freq. unit also. And yes welding aluminum does require a lot of Heat. I would be worried about the damage the heat may do to other parts in the trans, like the bearing and seals. To do the job correctly you should take the trans apart. I have been welding for 35 years so I know a little bit about it. I would do what other member have suggested. File the edges so it does not spread, paint it, and put it back together. Ride Safe Detroit