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Anti-Fog Shields - Where are they?


Rusty1945

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>rant on< Why is it that the two major high end helmet makers, Arai and Shoei, do not (to my knowledge) sell any model street helmet with an anti-fog shield? A good number of mid to low end helmets come with them now, most notably HJC. With the prices Arai and Shoei charge, it's a scandle that they don't provide an anti-fog shield. There. >rant off<

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+1,000! I've been harpin' about that myself. Pinlock's the usual response I get.
No, it's not THAT easy... There are no Pinlock's for Arai's. You are pretty much stuck with some spray-on stuff (or cat crap) or Fog City with an Arai. I'd buy one if there was a Pinlock.
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(Canadian accent) Ooo, soary, eh.

I've got the Shoei and was ticked. I didn't know Arai was even worse!

I spent 20 minutes last night putting various witch's brews for no fog on my shield in preparation for the new Super-Visor I got. So I put the helmet on, sit on the bike in the garage to figure the best position for the visor. 5 seconds later, I can barely see out through all the fog on my shield. dopeslap.gif Argh!

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http://www.pinlockusa.com/

 

An plastic sheet which attaches with eccentric pins to the inside of the visor to reduce fogging. Similar to the fog-city inserts except since they are attached with pins instead of glue you can replace them easily and buy different colors/tints to change as needed.

cycleworld.jpg

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... Similar to the fog-city inserts except since they are attached with pins instead of glue you can replace them easily and buy different colors/tints to change as needed...

The pins have another huge advantage over glue... the curvature of your visor presses the insert against the visor eliminating airspace between them. Fog City will eventually allow moist air in the airpocket between the insert the and the visor, which will condense on the visor surface in the cold.

 

Don't know why they don't seem to import them, but Pinlock's European site has them for Arai.

Probably too small a market? Americans, for the most part, are much more recreational riders, and generally will store the bike for the winter. We don't rely on our bikes for transporation... like the rest of world does.

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I just ordered a shield & Pinlock for my Shoei from a local shop. He said "Great product. Lousy marketing. You're only the 2nd guy in 2 years to ask about it." Another 2 "dealers" weren't aware they were dealers. dopeslap.gif

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I wonder why the instructions with the PinLock say not to use it at night.

 

I tried it at night with my brand-new pinlock shield and clear filter for my Shoei, and I thought it was fine. There are some *very* slight additional reflections of headlights and streetlights, but these reflections add only a little to the reflections you get with the regular shield by itself. It was much better than my alternatives of riding with a fogged shield, or with the shield wide open and no eye protection.

 

Anybody know why they say to not use at night?

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Are these helmets coming with an insert or with coated shields? If the latter I would not want one. I have a Schuberth with a coated shield and it is useless in the rain. The coated shield works by absorbing moisture. When it reaches its saturation point it is just like trying to look through a sheet of water. It reduces your vision so much it becomes difficult to read the instruments. One of my winter projects is to wash the coating off the inside of this shield. I know other owners of this helmet say it doesn't happen to them but it happened repeatedly to me and to at least two others that I have talked to.

 

>rant on< Why is it that the two major high end helmet makers, Arai and Shoei, do not (to my knowledge) sell any model street helmet with an anti-fog shield? A good number of mid to low end helmets come with them now, most notably HJC. With the prices Arai and Shoei charge, it's a scandle that they don't provide an anti-fog shield. There. >rant off<
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I wonder why the instructions with the PinLock say not to use it at night.
I think it's just a blanket warning aimed at the tinted ones. I.e. - They package the same instruction sheet with all of the inserts, including the clear ones.

 

[hijack]

Anybody have any good suggestions on how to clean the pinlock inserts? The material is so soft, every time I try something I just end up scratching it.

[/hijack]

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I'm with Pictou. I have a BMW System 5 helmet (see my avatar) with an anti-fog lining. On cool mornings around here, the anti-fog layer quickly reaches the saturation point and develops this crinkly Saran-wrap effect that reduces visibility significantly. To make matters worse, even when dry the anti-fog layer creates a very subtle, but noticable translucent effect, especially when the sun is low in the sky, making the shield hazy and harder to see through.

 

The rest of the helmet is SOOOO quiet, comfortable, and cool-looking, that I can live with it. Besides, how often is it cool in the morning around here?

 

In the future, I will elect no anti-fog treatment on my faceshields.

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Eh?

I have a Shuberth so do not have a problem with my shield it is phenomenal for not fogging.

However, my glasses are another issue. I recently ran across this

http://zooke.com/shop/catalog.php

It is GREAT stuff, put it on the glasses, anti-reflective progressives, and no fog even when it is super cold out, eh?

The anti fog paste is just a micro dab on each lens and polish, takes out scratches and makes them fog free. The cleaner works well too. The only negative is if you clean them with the one product you will have to re-apply the anti-fog the next time you need it, so it stays in my tank bag with a good cloth.

Do not know how it would work on a face shield as the Shuberth is pretty specific that you DO NOT apply anything. But don't need to.

Stuff works good I would buy it again but in the amounts you use I don't see a need for at least a couple of years.

 

No affiliation eh just a happy customer. thumbsup.gif

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I wish my experience was as positive as yours. I really love the Schuberth except for the problem with the anti-fog coating. Have you ridden with yours in the rain? This is where I have problems. It quickly gets saturated and you can't see a damn thing. This problem makes the helmet all but worthless for me when touring. I would by buy a non-coated shield in a second but I understand that Schuberth does not make one.

 

Eh?

I have a Shuberth so do not have a problem with my shield it is phenomenal for not fogging.

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Really?

I have ridden in heavy rain, fog, cold, mist etc etc, never had a fogging issue with the shield.

I follow their recommendations religiously though.

Wash the inside with water only and let dry for at least 12 hours.

No nothing on the inside as far as cleaners etc.

My brother has ridden with his and reports the same, never fogs up. thumbsup.gif

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When I started reading this thread about fogging, I thought someone would get around to the Schuberths. I love mine. I have three helmets and the Schuberth is the favorite. Fogging is not a problem, even in the rain. Even if I cough it doesn't fog. I think two things are going on here. First the vent on top really works; it seems like the top vents on my other helmets are mostly cosmetic. So I get some air flow there. Second, the Schuberth has the ability to pop open the visor by pushing it *forward* (away from the helmet) a smidgen, letting air flow in around the edges of the visor, so you don't have to swing the visor up for more air unless you want to. There are two "smidgen" adjustments, one on each side. You can use either one or both. When they are both open, the visor appears closed (no rain on you face) but there is no way you can fog it up. Any the freash air flow is nice.

 

Plus the built-in adjustable tinted sun visor means I don't have to fool with sunglasses anymore. If I had a gripe it would be that the release (the red thingy in the photo below) for the flip-up is a little hard to fool with, but I can live with it.

 

Schuberth_Concept_2_Helmet.jpg

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There have been other threads about the Schuberth anti-fog coating. Apparently there was a "bad batch" of shields where the coating flaked off. Mine was one of them. It also looked like celophane when it rained or just riding in the cold. I eventually removed the coating with Pledge and soap. I bought a replacement shield which hasn't had the coating flake off, but it doesn't prevent fog any better than the first with the coating removed. I still like the helmet except it's noisy.

 

I'd really like to try the Pinlock system. I wonder if you can see the pins with your perpheral vision and do they bother you.

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Clearly, you don't ride when it gets cold! ;)

 

In the cold, I have to keep vents open in order to keep the screen clear, and it fogs quite easily. For whatever reason, I have more trouble in the morning, on my way to work, and less trouble in the afternoon/evening coming home. Go figure.

 

I'm trying to find either the breathguard from Schubert, or an Original Foggy to reduce breathing out onto the shield. We'll see.

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I can tell you that my experience with the Schuberth and fogging up has been dismal. I am glad yours is otherwise.

 

I own 5 other helmets (2 Arai, 2 Shoei and 1 HJC) and the Schuberth is by far the worst of the bunch when it comes to fogging. Perhpas as another poster has suggested the shield is defective.

 

Like you I have always followed the instructions. At this point I think the only thing I can do is try to source another shield (I have been trouble finding one) and remove the coating from the existing shield.

 

Really?

I have ridden in heavy rain, fog, cold, mist etc etc, never had a fogging issue with the shield.

I follow their recommendations religiously though.

Wash the inside with water only and let dry for at least 12 hours.

No nothing on the inside as far as cleaners etc.

My brother has ridden with his and reports the same, never fogs up. thumbsup.gif

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There must be some other reason that some shields fog on some and the same does not fog on others.

Either physiological differences, the amount of water expired or some other issue.

One thing it could be is I ride with my helmet completely in the air stream. I raise the windscreen on the bike only in rain or fog and then only enough to get the wind to keep the rain flowing off the shield.

I also always ride with one side or the other 'bumped' open, depends on where the wind is coming from. Even when its in the high 20's F I like the shield open a little.

Maybe thats it?

 

As I mentioned before though, my glasses fog something awful until I put that Zooke stuff on now I am ready to go in any weather! clap.gif

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I've been riding with a Fog city insert in my HJC for 4 years.(actually been through two of them as they scratch easily).I've ridden at 40F in pouring rain all day, in fog,below freezing when my mirrors and windshield would alternately fog up and clear, and I've never, ever had my faceshield fog up. Not even when deliberately breathing on it for testing purposes. I would think that if you're getting fog between the two layers, the fog city was not installed properly (not airtight). Just my two cents worth.Not great at night -wierd reflections, but tolerable.

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>rant on< Why is it that the two major high end helmet makers, Arai and Shoei, do not (to my knowledge) sell any model street helmet with an anti-fog shield? A good number of mid to low end helmets come with them now, most notably HJC. With the prices Arai and Shoei charge, it's a scandle that they don't provide an anti-fog shield. There. >rant off<

 

Disclosure: I make Fogtech advanced anti-fog.

 

Only a guess, but if you read the complaints above about the Schuberth coating flaking off, you may have your answer. To date, these manufacturer applied coatings are soft and difficult to maintain long lasting performance.

 

They work by absorbing water. As they absorb, they swell up and then they shrink as they dry. These mechanical stresses cause the coating to flake off and eventually you lose the anti-fog protection. Also, if you wash the coating or handle it roughly, it can scratch or even delaminate.

 

These coatings are also difficult to apply consistently.

 

Perhaps the high end manufacturers, don't want the returns?

 

I just bought a Shoei X-11, and our anti-fog works well on it.

 

If you want a sample of Fogtech, email me your shipping address to gene (at) motosolutions (dot) com I will mail the sample. After you try, just let me know what type of helmet you have and how it worked.

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You ought to seriously consider the Scorpion line of helmets. Their full-face and 3/4 helmets come STANDARD with an anti-fog shield made by one of the premier anti-fog manufacturers in the world. By the way, Scorpion scored one point behind Arai in JD Powers latest helmet customer satisfaction survey. Arai has won this award for 8 years in a row. The fit is awesome, it has anti-fog shield, and you don't have to spend a lot.

 

Also, Scorpion now offers a photochromatic shield that turns dark in sunlight (like the transition glasses) AND it's anti-fog. No need for two shields!! I personally got one recently and love it.

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OK, ladies, finally crowbarred the wallet and bought the Pinlock for my Shoei. What the *^%$ took me so long??!! I am so in the habit of cracking the visor as I come to a stop that it's going to take unlearning. It works great! Hasn't rained yet, so no experience with that yet. I only worry about it's durability. But, we'll see.

Bringin' it on the "Oh, Gleno won't be there?" ride tomorrow. Expecting clear skies and face shields. thumbsup.gif

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