Interesting Oil article.

[Armando]

I stopped by Wal-Mart earlier this week to pickup some oil as I will be doing an oil change this weekend. Based on some of the posts I read last year, I had pretty much decided to stick to mineral oils until I had 15-20k miles on the odometer before switching to synthetic. Tonight I came across an article where the author states:

 

"The theory that synthetic oils should not be used during break in is the same as the theory that your engine will break in better if you use synthetic oil but add a dinner candle to your four quarts of engine oil. Frankly, I find this theory, um, questionable. Oh, hell, laughable."

 

The full write up is at --> http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html

 

What do you think? Is there something specific about the boxer engine that requires mineral oil duirng the break in period?

 

BTW - I picked up Wal-Mart's Super Tech 20W50 oil. Any opinions on this?

[David]

Data points:

 

The manuals for the newer engines specify dyno for a bit before the change.

 

RTP bikes typically come with synth.

 

There's very little evidence either way. In my personal experience and opinion, switch to synth whenever you want (mine quit using oil when I did).

 

The bigger question is why use synth in the first place. Most people doing so have no real reason to--just like the oil change intervals they follow.

[Mr. Frank]

The oilhead burns a lot of oil at first. Most people wait until the consumption drops off to switch to synth because the dino is a lot cheaper. It's also thought by some that break in might be faster with dino. The main advatage of synth for the oilhead is the wide range of temperatures possible in an air/oil cooled engine.

 

The problem with "Wal-Mart" oil is you don't know who makes it. If you are going to buy auto oil, Mobil I synthetic has a good reputation.

[barncobob]

just got a 2004, will switvh to syn. soon

bought a new 2001 porsche c4, mobil 1 factory fill- change at 12k

bought a new 2004 MBZ sl-500, mobil 1 factory fill- change at 12k

if its good enough for these 2 fine cars then its good \

enough for the bike.

[Armando]

From the Mobil1.com website

" Myth: You should break in your engine with conventional oil, then switch to a synthetic oil like Mobil 1.

Reality:

You can start using Mobil 1® in new vehicles at any time, even in brand new vehicles. In fact, Mobil 1 is original equipment (it is installed at the factory) in:

Aston Martin

Bentley Amage and Bentley GT

Cadillac CTS, CTS-V, XLR, XLR-V, SRX and STS and STS-V

Chevrolet Corvette C6 and Z06

Chevrolet SSR

Chevrolet TrailBlazer SS

Chrysler 300C SRT-8 and Crossfire SRT-6

Cobalt SS

Dodge Ram SRT-10

Dodge Charger SRT-8, Magnum, and Viper

Jeep Cherokee SRT-8

Mercedes-Benz AMG vehicles

Mercedes SLR

Mitsubishi EVO III

Pontiac GTO

All Porsche vehicles

Saturn Red Line

Viper SRT-10

One of the myths surrounding synthetic oils is that new engines require a break-in period with conventional oil. The fact is, current engine manufacturing technology does not require this break-in period. As indicated by the decisions of the engineers who design the high-performance cars listed above, Mobil 1 can be used starting the day you drive the car off the showroom floor. "

 

"Myth: Motorcycles can't benefit from synthetic oil.

Reality:

Motorcycles are an ideal application for synthetic oil. ExxonMobil offers three fully synthetic motor oils for motorcycles:

Mobil 1 MX4T is recommended for on-road, high-performance, 4-cycle sport bikes, which are typically liquid cooled. It can also be used in air-cooled engines calling for a 10W-40 oil.

Mobil 1 V-Twin is a 20W-50 oil recommended for 4-cycle V-twin engines, particularly those that are air cooled and tend to run hotter than other types of engines.

Mobil 1 Racing 2T is recommended for two-cycle motorcycle engines that specify the use of a pre-mix, two-cycle engine oil."

[MotoBoy]

Interesting, as all oil threads seem to be. But Synthetic does NOT come factory installed (unless things have changed), at least in boxer BMW bikes. (David notes that RTPs arrive this way, but the're likely subjected to different operational reigimes than most new boxers.) At least the conventional wisdom has been that in air/oil cooled engines, ring/cylinder wear-in and ring seating occur faster with conventional oil, and once this has happened, it's then fine to select either dino or synth.

 

It's interesting to note that the Mobil list of factory-installed Mobil machines seems pretty short on air / oil cooled engines. And these engines, due to their somewhat wider temperature operation profiles, are manufactured to different tolerances than water cooled engines, to allow for the differing expansion / contraction ranges their parts see during break-in and long-term operation.

 

If I recall correctly, Mobil got out of the light aircraft engine oil business a while back (also air / oil cooled boxers) because of excessive engine failures. One of the issues was that as the engines sat for sometimes days or weeks between use, the oil was so "slippery" that it all ran off of wear surfaces so that they were unprotected until the oil pressure had built up again and enough oil had circulated. This might have no "bearing" on bike engines, though RT engines are a lot like horizontally opposed aircraft engines in many respects.

 

Also, there are some fairly significant differences in additive packages between auto oil and bike oil. That probably does not matter if you change oil frequently and if you don't want to keep your bike forever. Me, I used dino until 12k miles and now run synthetic ...

 

As always, it's your engine and your money. We need more test pilots.

[barncobob]

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_V-Twin_20W-50.aspx

[No_Twilight]

This thread repeats itself periodicly and I've honed my opinion down to a couple of sentences: There is no need for synthetic oil on a BMW oilhead. Contrary to popular belief, it is NOT angel piss. The additives are consummable and drive oil change intervals. Use the proper viscosity and change per owner's manual. Use an oil filter.

 

--jerry

[SAAB93driver]

You need to check your hone, that is 4 sentences.

[Stan Walker]

And you need to check your fingers, it was 5 sentences.

 

Stan

[SAAB93driver]

right your are! I was so wrapped up in the K12GT exchange I lost my ability to type or count or maybe both.

[Pilgrim]

This thread repeats itself periodicly and I've honed my opinion down to a couple of sentences: There is no need for synthetic oil on a BMW oilhead. Contrary to popular belief, it is NOT angel piss. The additives are consummable and drive oil change intervals. Use the proper viscosity and change per owner's manual. Use an oil filter.

 

--jerry

 

Well, maybe not. But almost.

 

I ran a load of Mobil 1 (the car stuff)in my RT out to 9,000 miles as an experiment when the previous analyses at lower mileages kept saying "suitable for further use". The 9,000 mile test admitted that I ought to think about changing it pretty soon.

 

That service life takes the "Oh, no!" out of realizing, halfway across Nevada on U.S. 50, you're going to break the 6k mark before you get to Reno. That, and the additional fifty degrees or so of heat tolerance before it breaks down makes the use of Mobil 1 worthwhile for me.

 

It's not that it lubes better, just that it lasts better.

 

Pilgrim

[NoHeat]

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_V-Twin_20W-50.aspx

 

I wonder about the appropriateness of this, for use in a dry-clutch bike:

"Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 engine oil is also designed to provide the proper frictional characteristics necessary for wet-clutch engine/transmission systems."

[NoHeat]

Use the proper viscosity and change per owner's manual. Use an oil filter.

 

--jerry

 

Probably that's enough. How often do you hear complaints of engine damage that can be attributed to the oil, as compared to complaints of failure in other parts of the drive train?

 

Maybe the only reason that threads aren't full of compelling debates on final drive lube and spline grease is that you don't see the stuff everywhere, on huge shelves full of different kinds, as you do with motor oil.

[barncobob]

no heat. you are putting in your own punctuation marks where you want the sentence to end. drop your period that is not there and the sentence continues " or where the engine lubrication system is separate from the transmission system.' MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE. if you cant comprehend synthetic oil then keep using dino; some of us get it.

[tone1298]

I switched to syntheic at 16K (Mobil 1 for air cooled motorcycle 9$/quart)... It does seem to use less oil... but it never got too low w/dino.

[No_Twilight]

if you cant comprehend synthetic oil then keep using dino; some of us get it.

Seems you're really stretching to try to insult us. Relax and enjoy your oil. I'm glad you enjoy it. --Jerry

[chrisx]

ah yes... the unstoppable oil war. fwiw i found this

http://ramaircraft.com/Whats-New-Ticker/...der-Package.htm obviously not a bike but they are adamant in regards to dino oil in nikasil liner. I plan on staying with dino for longer than i'd like to and then will switch to amsoil. that oil is actually devil piss. but since satan was tossed from heaven for singing too loudly off key... i guess it still counts as holy water. . my preference for synth is simply that i have to not change it so often. my turbo saabs call out a 3k oil change interval. i go 10 and probably coudl go 15 with my remote filter setup. the most improtant thing about is that it is clean and of moderate quality. the rest is all just fussing over the baby... and you know how rt owners hate to fuss over their bikes. unfortunately mine is not surging so i have devolved into just riding it.... ohhh the humanity....

[No_Twilight]

Use the proper viscosity and change per owner's manual. Use an oil filter.

 

--jerry

 

Probably that's enough.

 

 

Yeah, really I distilled my opinion down to Two sentences but couldn't resist 3 or 4 sentences of editorializing...

 

--Jerry

[NoHeat]

no heat. you are putting in your own punctuation marks where you want the sentence to end. drop your period that is not there and the sentence continues " or where the engine lubrication system is separate from the transmission system.' MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE. if you cant comprehend synthetic oil then keep using dino; some of us get it.

 

My post was rather unimportant, but it was careful. I precisely quoted the fourth complete sentence in the first paragraph in the source that I linked, and I retained exactly the original punctuation.

 

This site is remarkably free of flame wars and such things, and I look forward to its retaining that fine character.

[Boffin]

 

This site is remarkably free of flame wars and such things, and I look forward to its retaining that fine character.

 

what a fine sentiment......

 

Andy

[No_Twilight]

 

This site is remarkably free of flame wars and such things, and I look forward to its retaining that fine character.

 

what a fine sentiment......

 

Andy

 

Well said. Oil is perhaps the most emotional subject in motorsports. If we can stay pretty civil discussing oil, then we'll be ok. --Jerry

[BUSTED]

I changed one 1100RT to Mobil 1 at 4,500 miles and the other at 986 miles. No oil usage between changes and no oil issues of any kind in either bike. A friend changed his K1100LT and his oilhead RT at their first service to Mobil 1 and won the MOA Mileage Contest Award back to back those years. he had no oil related issues either. For myself, to wait is a waste of time.

[RFW]

The FAQ referred to at the end..."Can heavy-duty diesel oil be used in motorcycles?" verifies what a Chevron engineer told me.

 

I have used Chevron's Delo 400, and lately, Shell's Rotella-T "diesel oils" in my K100 for years. They are relatively cheap, contain more of the ZDDP that is increasingly being removed from "car oils", and (importantly) are approved by BMW's oils bulletin from a few years back.

 

The FAQ corroborates teh reasons I was given why these oils are a good choice.

[4wheeldog]

If I recall correctly, Mobil got out of the light aircraft engine oil business a while back (also air / oil cooled boxers) because of excessive engine failures. One of the issues was that as the engines sat for sometimes days or weeks between use, the oil was so "slippery" that it all ran off of wear surfaces so that they were unprotected until the oil pressure had built up again and enough oil had circulated. This might have no "bearing" on bike engines, though RT engines are a lot like horizontally opposed aircraft engines in many respects.

The reason that Mobil 1 aviation oil failed was because it did a poor job of holding lead in suspension.....And av gas has quite a bit of lead in it.

I used Mobil 1 in an aircraft with an STC for Mogas....Automotive gas.......And since there was no lead, it worked great. Actually used less fuel and far less oil than with conventional av oil that I had to go back to.

[wolcott]

In regards to the OP's first post- I was in wal-mart oil aisle, when 2 of the oil changers were in the aisle grabbing some filters off the shelf. they had run out of stock in the garage of a particular type. When I asked who made that Super-Tech Wal-mart oil, they said as far as they knew it was Valvoline. Plus, they will knock $2 off an car oil change, if you would like to supply your own oil filter.