Clutch slipping

[Dave_in_TX]

Thr clutch on my 2023 R1250GS has started slipping under hard acceleration. I'm guessing it's worn friction plates or springs. I'm surprised about this because the bike only has 60k miles on it and my 2012 GS had the original clutch when it was sold at 135k miles and my 2020 GS had the original clutch when it was totaled in an accident at 93k.

 

I'm wondering if this something I should attempt myself. I replaced the clutch many years ago on a Kawasaki in-line fourvwithout too much trouble.

[c10]

Where in TX are you ?  

[Dave_in_TX]

Just southwest of Austin.

[TEWKS]

Obviously I’m not telling you anything you don’t already know but the clutch is in a way better location to work on compared with the older 1200 Camheads.

 

This ReKluse video gives you an idea of the work you’re looking at.

Link

[wbw6cos]

Wow!   That looks easy.

[Dave_in_TX]

59 minutes ago, TEWKS said:

Obviously I’m not telling you anything you don’t already know but the clutch is in a way better location to work on compared with the older 1200 Camheads.

 

This ReKluse video gives you an idea of the work you’re looking at.

Link

Thanks, I've seen that video. Not sure about OEM, but the Rekluse kit has different thickness friction plates that need to be installed in a specific order.

[SEMPERFIURAL]

I replaced the worn out clutch on a 2019 GS and installed Rekluse - straight forward and easy.  You can do it! 

[TEWKS]

2 hours ago, SEMPERFIURAL said:

  You can do it! 

Now, did you happen to say that ^ to This Guy?  He just hit it!  Sorry for interrupting the “clutch talk” but, you have a pretty cool YouTube channel! 

[SEMPERFIURAL]

9 hours ago, TEWKS said:

Now, did you happen to say that ^ to This Guy?  He just hit it!  Sorry for interrupting the “clutch talk” but, you have a pretty cool YouTube channel! 

Oh - that guy!  The first one is my friend Jonas - he insisted on bringing his RT to off-road training that day.  I built that teeter totter a couple years ago - it's gotten lots of use and abuse!  

[Chris K]

I replaced the clutch on my 2013 GS. The hardest part was getting the suspension compressed enough to take the clutch cover off, everything else was easy.

[craydds]

16 hours ago, SEMPERFIURAL said:

I replaced the worn out clutch on a 2019 GS and installed Rekluse - straight forward and easy.  You can do it! 

When it's time to replace my clutch, I will do it myself.  I have installed Rekluse clutches on dirt bikes.  How do you like the Rekluse on your BMW?  Any better than OEM?

[Dave_in_TX]

3 hours ago, Chris K said:

I replaced the clutch on my 2013 GS. The hardest part was getting the suspension compressed enough to take the clutch cover off, everything else was easy.

That's what I'm starting to think.

[SEMPERFIURAL]

On 12/28/2024 at 10:52 AM, craydds said:

When it's time to replace my clutch, I will do it myself.  I have installed Rekluse clutches on dirt bikes.  How do you like the Rekluse on your BMW?  Any better than OEM?

I did mine a couple years back - had 32K on bike when original clutch starting slipping.  It had stronger engagement than the OEM from what I remember.   I ended up snapping steering stop on that bike and insurance totaled it out for me.  On a 2024 GSA 1250 now - when I have to replace the clutch, I'll definitely use Rekluse again.  

[Dave_in_TX]

On 12/27/2024 at 5:43 PM, SEMPERFIURAL said:

I replaced the worn out clutch on a 2019 GS and installed Rekluse - straight forward and easy.  You can do it! 

Did you have trouble getting the suspension compressed like Chris did?

[TEWKS]

Seems straightforward using a ratchet strap.  I would snap the brake caliper mount casting but that’s just me, you’ll have no such problem. 

 

edit

think I’d use two straps, one on each side

[Dave_in_TX]

I've seen a video using just one. It seems straight forward but I assumed that Chris had used a ratchet strap.

[TEWKS]

Well if the ratchet straps don’t work.   You could always call Big Jake over to compress that suspension. He works for lunch I’m told. 

 

 

[SEMPERFIURAL]

15 hours ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Did you have trouble getting the suspension compressed like Chris did?

No - just used straps - the top bolts were a little challenging to get to but it's doable.  I did mine on the garage floor - a lift would have made job much easier.   Fast forward two years - I have a lift now 

[Dave_in_TX]

On 12/27/2024 at 5:43 PM, SEMPERFIURAL said:

I replaced the worn out clutch on a 2019 GS and installed Rekluse - straight forward and easy. 

Did the Rekluse kit include springs? I think I should replace them while I'm in there. 

[SEMPERFIURAL]

2 hours ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Did the Rekluse kit include springs? I think I should replace them while I'm in there. 

Had to go back and look at a photo from when I did work - yes, new springs included! 

 

Edited December 30, 2024 by SEMPERFIURAL
updated with jpeg image

[Dave_in_TX]

Interesting, Rekluse's installation PDF says the original springs get reused. I sent Rekluse a message asking  about springs; haven't heard back yet.

[TEWKS]

What’s the benefit of the ReKluse? I’m foggy on the operation of that system. No pulling in the clutch when you stop? 

[Rougarou]

3 minutes ago, TEWKS said:

What’s the benefit of the ReKluse?

 

About $240

[Dave_in_TX]

20 minutes ago, TEWKS said:

What’s the benefit of the ReKluse? I’m foggy on the operation of that system. No pulling in the clutch when you stop? 

Rekluse claims:

• TorqDrive® clutch pack delivers higher torque capacity and increased power transfer
• Eliminates clutch fade in extreme conditions
• Improved durability and reliability
• Smoother shifting and improved lever feel
• Rekluse sleeves eliminate basket wear and notching

Users seem to agree on the shifting and reliability.

[Dave_in_TX]

22 minutes ago, Rougarou said:

 

About $240

Difference is only about $20 if you include OEM springs in price of OEM.

[Bernie]

On 12/27/2024 at 12:58 PM, Dave_in_TX said:

Thr clutch on my 2023 R1250GS has started slipping under hard acceleration. I'm guessing it's worn friction plates or springs. I'm surprised about this because the bike only has 60k miles on it and my 2012 GS had the original clutch when it was sold at 135k miles and my 2020 GS had the original clutch when it was totaled in an accident at 93k.

 

I'm wondering if this something I should attempt myself. I replaced the clutch many years ago on a Kawasaki in-line fourvwithout too much trouble.

Would you mind disclosing what brand and version of motor oil you use in your bike?

 

[Rougarou]

1 hour ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Difference is only about $20 if you include OEM springs in price of OEM.

 

My bad, I just went off of "clutch package" vice just the bits Recluse is replacing.

[Hosstage]

2 hours ago, TEWKS said:

What’s the benefit of the ReKluse? I’m foggy on the operation of that system. No pulling in the clutch when you stop? 

Recluse sells clutch replacements, as well as automatic clutch systems. 2 separate products.

Clutch material is usually more robust than stock, more material on the discs. That is the benefit over OEM.

[TEWKS]

Just now, Hosstage said:

Recluse sells clutch replacements, as well as automatic clutch systems. 2 separate products.

Thank you, that was kinda my confusion.  Among six dozen other subjects. 

[Dave_in_TX]

1 hour ago, Rougarou said:

 

My bad, I just went off of "clutch package" vice just the bits Recluse is replacing.

No problem

[Dave_in_TX]

1 hour ago, Bernie said:

Would you mind disclosing what brand and version of motor oil you use in your bike?

 

Motul 7100 4T 5w40 or Liqui Moly 4T 5w40 depending on which is more readily available or cheaper, same as I used on my 2014 (135k miles on original clutch when sold) and 2020 (93k on original clutch  when totaled in an accident).

[SEMPERFIURAL]

5 hours ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Interesting, Rekluse's installation PDF says the original springs get reused. I sent Rekluse a message asking  about springs; haven't heard back yet.

 

This should help - shows you all the parts you'll receive and how they go in:

https://www.rekluse.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/RMS-2809018.pdf

[Dave_in_TX]

9 hours ago, SEMPERFIURAL said:

No - just used straps - the top bolts were a little challenging to get to but it's doable.  I did mine on the garage floor - a lift would have made job much easier.   Fast forward two years - I have a lift now 

Since getting access to the top bolts of the cover by compressing the suspension appears to be the difficult part, I decided to try that today. with much difficulty, I was able to get it compressed a little but not enough to help access the top bolts on the cover. After spending quite a bit of effort on this, it occurred to me that since my GS has the low suspension, it might require more compression than with standard so that might not work for me. I saw a video on youtube of a clutch replacement where they removed the front wheel and fork tubes to access the cover plate. That's more involved than what I want to tackle.

[TEWKS]

My 2014 ESA equipped RT is in a “locked position” (meaning you can’t compress the suspension) with the key turned off. Don’t know if that’s what you were dealing with on yours today… 

[Toter]

I noticed that on my 23 GSA. No suspension bounce when shut off.

[Chris K]

My problem getting the suspension compressed was that all I had were the wider ratchet straps with the large metal hooks. It made it hard to compress the suspension enough to get the cover off. Luckily I had Alan there to use his mass to compress it the last few millimeters. 

[Dave_in_TX]

4 hours ago, Chris K said:

My problem getting the suspension compressed was that all I had were the wider ratchet straps with the large metal hooks. It made it hard to compress the suspension enough to get the cover off. Luckily I had Alan there to use his mass to compress it the last few millimeters. 

unfortunately, I don't have Allen available.😊

[Dave_in_TX]

@SEMPERFIURAL and @Chris K must have used heavier duty ratchet straps than the ones I originally tried. Searched around the garage and found some stronger ones. Was able to get shock compressed enough to just barely get to the top T30 screws. Have a stubby T30 coming from Amazon that should fit much better.

[Dave_in_TX]

Still undecided whether to do the work myself or let a shop do it. Only "local" shop I would trust will not give an estimate of the time required, so that eliminates them. Got an estimate from the closest dealer (45 min away) of almost $1600. The next closest dealer (1-1/2 hr away) only wants about $1200. Certainly won't have closest dealer do it.

[Dave_in_TX]

The local shop I trust finally gave me a quote (after some research, I assume). His quote is for $991 using the Rekluse kit.  The other quotes are using OEM parts. However, the quotes using the following assembly which includes a part (greyed out in image below) not included in the Rekluse kit. This part is not included but is probably not needed.

 

[TEWKS]

$991 with parts, not bad. Assuming the clutch kit must be 4/5 hundred… 

[Dave_in_TX]

9 hours ago, TEWKS said:

$991 with parts, not bad. Assuming the clutch kit must be 4/5 hundred… 

Rekluse kit is $670. Labor is $270.

[TEWKS]

3 minutes ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Rekluse kit is $670. Labor is $270.

Labor is very fair! 

[Dave_in_TX]

46 minutes ago, TEWKS said:

Labor is very fair! 

Yes, two hours at $135/hr. Surprisingly, one BMW dealer was slightly cheaper with 1.8 hours at 145/hr for a total of $261.

[Motorhead1977]

Labor quote seems very fair. In my humble opinion, at $270, it's not worth 2 hours of my time to do that work myself. Just my $.02 🙂

[SEMPERFIURAL]

1 hour ago, Dave_in_TX said:

Yes, two hours at $135/hr. Surprisingly, one BMW dealer was slightly cheaper with 1.8 hours at 145/hr for a total of $261.

Curious - Are you planning to change oil / filter in conjunction with clutch replacement?

[Limecreek]

Dave - let's hope the clutch hub or cage is not involved and the source of your gear engagement problem.  

[Skywagon]

Man… that sounds like a bargain. What city is the tech in. Might be worth a trip for me if I needed something. Local Houston BMW has lost their mind on labor. 

[Dave_in_TX]

5 hours ago, Limecreek said:

Dave - let's hope the clutch hub or cage is not involved and the source of your gear engagement problem.  

Greg, clutch engagement seems fine at low to mid RPMs. It only slips under hard acceleration so it's probably plates or springs.

[Dave_in_TX]

3 hours ago, Skywagon said:

Man… that sounds like a bargain. What city is the tech in. Might be worth a trip for me if I needed something. Local Houston BMW has lost their mind on labor. 

David, the independent tech is in Marble Falls. If the Houston dealer is like the Austin dealer who charges $175/hour, you might also consider the San Antonio dealer. They were actually a couple of dollars cheaper on labor because they quoted only 1.8 hours labor while the independent tech quoted 2 hours, and the Austin dealer quoted 2.1 hours.