04 1150RT oil leak throttle side cylinder

[46nto]

Hi folks! I'm fighting an oil leak on my right cylinder. I've recently replaced the valve cover gaskets & bushings in the cover. I smeared hi temp grease into the grooves on the gaskets which helped me seal up the left side valve cover. All valve cover bolts are torqued to 9nm. I've still got a leak that develops on the right side & I'm having a tough time figuring out where. It could well be the cam sprocket cover o ring which I plan to replace to see if that's the issue. Aside from the cylinder base gasket or head gasket, is there anything else I should be looking at. The leak seams to be on the top end & once it gets flowing, gets caught by the wind & blown onto my right boot. It's not a horrible leak by any means but I'd like to get it stopped. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears!

 

Thanks!

 

Kris

[dirtrider]

1 hour ago, 46nto said:

Hi folks! I'm fighting an oil leak on my right cylinder. I've recently replaced the valve cover gaskets & bushings in the cover. I smeared hi temp grease into the grooves on the gaskets which helped me seal up the left side valve cover. All valve cover bolts are torqued to 9nm. I've still got a leak that develops on the right side & I'm having a tough time figuring out where. It could well be the cam sprocket cover o ring which I plan to replace to see if that's the issue. Aside from the cylinder base gasket or head gasket, is there anything else I should be looking at. The leak seams to be on the top end & once it gets flowing, gets caught by the wind & blown onto my right boot. It's not a horrible leak by any means but I'd like to get it stopped. If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears!

 

Thanks!

 

Kris

Afternoon Kris

 

There is cup shaped "O" ring between the valve cover & the spark plug area on the cylinder head, those are sometimes prone to leaking. Have you checked that?  

 

[46nto]

Yes, sir, I replaced them both when I did the valve clearance check (along with the cover gaskets) about 3000 miles ago. The more I think about it, the possibility that the cam sprocket cover o ring may be the issue. I think the oil may be dribbling down the cylinder when the bike is off & when I'm riding, it's blowing back with the air traveling along the cooling fins. I had really thought it was the valve cover gasket or donut seal but I'm confident those are sealing properly.

 

I appreciate the repy @dirtrider!

[dirtrider]

4 minutes ago, 46nto said:

Yes, sir, I replaced them both when I did the valve clearance check (along with the cover gaskets) about 3000 miles ago. The more I think about it, the possibility that the cam sprocket cover o ring may be the issue. I think the oil may be dribbling down the cylinder when the bike is off & when I'm riding, it's blowing back with the air traveling along the cooling fins. I had really thought it was the valve cover gasket or donut seal but I'm confident those are sealing properly.

 

I appreciate the repy @dirtrider!

Morning 46nto

 

There is a cam chain tensioner on the bottom of the R/H cylinder, make sure that isn't seeping or leaking. 

 

I have also seen the fork seal leak & blow back on the engine looking like an engine oil leak.  

 

Even farther up there is the oil thermostat, oil temperature switch,  & oil cooler hoses so check that area. 

[46nto]

Thanks DR!! I'll give those items a good look for sure. I appreciate the advice.

[Jim Moore]

Head gasket leaks are not unheard of either.

[46nto]

Thanks @Jim Moore! I need to get in there & clean it up again then look it over every single time I get off the bike. Hopefully, this time I can determine the source before it's blowing onto my boot.

[RPG]

As D.R. points out, verify if it is the donut gasket by removing the center spark plug cover to check for oil in the channel. There should be none.

I had this problem several times when doing valve adjustments on my '04 RT and it was always the donut gasket shifting around when installing.

[46nto]

Well, I figured out where it’s coming from: the valve cover gasket again. It’s leaking on the bottom part of the cover. I’m not sure what’s going on here unless the cover isn’t flat. I’ll check it with a straight edge when I take it off & put a new gasket in later this week. 

Anyone have any idea what might be going on here? 

Thanks to everyone giving me ideas here, it definitely appreciated!

[Lowndes]

Did that valve cover take a hit at some point??  Might check for flatness.(easy to do).

 

The valve cover screw holes in the head are drilled to a specific depth to prevent over-tightening of the screws. You might check the depths of the holes and make sure none of the OEM screws have been replaced with a generic screw of a different length, longer or shorter.

 

No dings in the gasket?? 

 

Might try a thin bead of RTV on both sides of the gasket if everything else checks out OK.

 

Tell us what you find and how you fixed it. With pics, too!!

 

[46nto]

It doesn’t look like the cover has taken a hit. I honestly don’t know whether the bolts are original. The gaskets & rubber bushings I’m using are from Beemer Boneyard. They seal up fine on the left cylinder.
 

Here’s a pic I just took. It was clean when I hopped on the bike & 5 miles later it looks like this. Seems that it may be starting up on the leading edge of the cylinder but hard to tell for sure. I’ll pull it off later today, clean everything, check for straightness all around & seal it with some kinds of high temp rtv. 

[dirtrider]

40 minutes ago, 46nto said:

It doesn’t look like the cover has taken a hit. I honestly don’t know whether the bolts are original. The gaskets & rubber bushings I’m using are from Beemer Boneyard. They seal up fine on the left cylinder.
 

Here’s a pic I just took. It was clean when I hopped on the bike & 5 miles later it looks like this. Seems that it may be starting up on the leading edge of the cylinder but hard to tell for sure. I’ll pull it off later today, clean everything, check for straightness all around & seal it with some kinds of high temp rtv. 

Morning 46nto

 

I see signs of oil blowing on the front of the cylinder at one time. Did you clean anything on the valve cover before taking that picture. 

 

If that picture is (just after a ride) & not cleaned then it looks like your cover gasket is not sealing properly. That doesn't necessarily mean a bad gasket, just that it isn't fully sealing. 

 

Has the valve cover bolt attachment in the cylinder area been messed with (like nut-serts, or heli-coils, etc?).

 

Some types of thread repairs leave a flange on the top of the cylinder head threaded boss that prevents the flange on the valve cover bolt from seating all the way down to the cylinder head casting. 

 

It doesn't take much added thickness to prevent proper valve cover bolt clamp-down. 

 

CAUTION: do not try to tighten the valve cover bolts past just snug as there is a bottoming flange on the valve cover bolts that bottoms on the cylinder head boss. It is very/very/very easy to overtighten & strip the soft alloy cylinder head threads out. 

 

The cover gaskets have ribs on them so if not cleaned before cover installation those ribs can retain oil then drip out after first ride. 

 

Before doing anything try riding the motorcycle a few times then clean the drips after each ride, after a couple of rides IF it still has drips then you will need to find the problem. If it is just the oil that was caught in the gasket ribs dripping then it should go away after a decent ride or two.   

[46nto]

Thanks DR. I should qualify my statement that it was clean. The bottom was clean when I left this morning. I didn't properly clean up the the rest. The thing with the leak is that the gasket sealed properly for around 3000 miles before it started leaking & I'm not sure what caused it to start leaking at that point. I had replaced the old gasket with new along with new donut seal & new bushing/grommets in the cover & torqued to spec at 9nm. I don't think the threads have been repaired in the head but I will look closer when I get in there later this afternoon. The threads are definitely sound, though. Thanks for the tip about not over tightening the cover bolts. I noticed the shoulders on the bolts, the first time I did a valve adjustment & have torqued them to spec every time. I'll also properly clean everything I can get to without removing the tupperware again. 

 

Would you recommend some kind of high temp rtv to help the seal or do you think I should just put the gasket on dry? Now that I think of it, I have another gasket so I'll use that on although the gasket that is in there only has 3000 miles on it. I'll also check the cover & head to see if they're true with a straightedge.

[dirtrider]

25 minutes ago, 46nto said:

Thanks DR. I should qualify my statement that it was clean. The bottom was clean when I left this morning. I didn't properly clean up the the rest. The thing with the leak is that the gasket sealed properly for around 3000 miles before it started leaking & I'm not sure what caused it to start leaking at that point. I had replaced the old gasket with new along with new donut seal & new bushing/grommets in the cover & torqued to spec at 9nm. I don't think the threads have been repaired in the head but I will look closer when I get in there later this afternoon. The threads are definitely sound, though. Thanks for the tip about not over tightening the cover bolts. I noticed the shoulders on the bolts, the first time I did a valve adjustment & have torqued them to spec every time. I'll also properly clean everything I can get to without removing the tupperware again. 

 

Would you recommend some kind of high temp rtv to help the seal or do you think I should just put the gasket on dry? Now that I think of it, I have another gasket so I'll use that on although the gasket that is in there only has 3000 miles on it. I'll also check the cover & head to see if they're true with a straightedge.

Morning 46nto

 

Personally, I just use a very light swipe of engine oil on the cover & cylinder sealing surfaces. Not a lot, a very light a wipe, just a thin layer to prevent the gasket form sticking at next removal.  

 

If that was your first ride after re-assembly then give it a ride or two then re-access. 

[46nto]

Thanks DR. I'll put the new gasket on with a very light swipe of fresh engine oil on the gasket when I reassemble.

[46nto]

I know this isn’t a very good photo but it appears there are inserts in all 4 valve cover bolt holes on the head. I can just catch my fingernail on them. I’m not taking the Tupperware off to remove the cylinder guard on the other side but did they come from the factory like this or were there threads tapped  right into the aluminum?

 

In any case, this could be my issue. I’m going to see if I can get carefully them flush with the aluminum with some emery cloth & a very small sanding b block. 

[dirtrider]

22 minutes ago, 46nto said:

I know this isn’t a very good photo but it appears there are inserts in all 4 valve cover bolt holes on the head. I can just catch my fingernail on them. I’m not taking the Tupperware off to remove the cylinder guard on the other side but did they come from the factory like this or were there threads tapped  right into the aluminum?

 

In any case, this could be my issue. I’m going to see if I can get carefully them flush with the aluminum with some emery cloth & a very small sanding b block. 

Evening  46nto

 

If they do in fact stick up above the cylinder head boss then they should be lowered, or add something under the bolt head to put a bit more pressure on the rubber gromet.

 

 

[46nto]

I think my fingernail was actually catching on the well between the head & the insert.
 

At any rate, I added a 3/8” washer between the grommet & capwasher then snugged them down. Just a short ride home tonight but Wednesday will be a better test as I’ve got about 160 mile round trip to one of our satellite shops. If it’s going to leak soon, I think it’ll show up on that trip. 

 

I’ll report back with a follow up post later in the week. 

[dirtrider]

12 hours ago, 46nto said:

I think my fingernail was actually catching on the well between the head & the insert.
 

At any rate, I added a 3/8” washer between the grommet & capwasher then snugged them down. Just a short ride home tonight but Wednesday will be a better test as I’ve got about 160 mile round trip to one of our satellite shops. If it’s going to leak soon, I think it’ll show up on that trip. 

 

I’ll report back with a follow up post later in the week. 

Morning 46nto

 

I looked at the picture on a better device this morning (way better detail) & those inserts don't look to be standing proud enough to cause issues. 

 

If those are in fact installed inserts then the  cylinder head must have been removed & done on a drill press, or probably a mill, as the job is top notch.

 

Either the above, or what we are seeing (& you are feeling) is just the ring & surface imperfections caused by the bottoming flange on the valve cover bolts. 

 

[46nto]

1 hour ago, dirtrider said:

Morning 46nto

 

I looked at the picture on a better device this morning (way better detail) & those inserts don't look to be standing proud enough to cause issues. 

 

If those are in fact installed inserts then the  cylinder head must have been removed & done on a drill press, or probably a mill, as the job is top notch.

 

Either the above, or what we are seeing (& you are feeling) is just the ring & surface imperfections caused by the bottoming flange on the valve cover bolts. 

 

 

Thank you, sir! I got the mating surfaces as clean as I could get them, checked to make sure the cover wasn't warped, checked for straightness as best as I could on the head & cover -everthing looks good. I added a washer to each cover bolt between the grommet & cap washer to add a bit more pressure to the cover bolts & snugged them down til I felt the bottoming flanges contact the head. I did a whopping 4 mile ride home & so far so good. Tomorrow's rides will tell a better story.

 

Thanks again for all your insight!

[46nto]

70ish miles this morning, no signs of oil leaking from the valve cover. 

[46nto]

140 miles, dry as a bone. I thinking shimming the cover bolt between grommet cap has made a positive improvement.