Rinkydink Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 I used to think I was fairly computer savvy. I worked in Telcom configuring dense wave division multiplexers, various data and voice transmission circuits and the likes for over 41 years and did ok. I have no Microsoft certifications but always somehow figured it out. Skip ahead to Basecamp. Is it really this complicated? It is giving me fits. 1 Link to comment
TEWKS Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 I surrendered and ran back to MapSource. 1 Link to comment
roadscholar Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 My long time riding buddy Dave didn’t go to college but drove a train for 40 years and was also a RR yard manager/superintendent. He taught himself Mapsource then Basecamp and is proficient at both. He taught me the basics of Mapsource, it’s enough to get routes to our guys that need them. Most of our younger guys can whip thru Basecamp but not me, seems totally counterintuitive. If it was the only option I’d have to learn it but it’s not for my purposes. Kinsley would always give me a ration of crap for being a gps dufus : ) 2 Link to comment
RandyShields Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 Mapsource was pretty easy. I was sorry to see it no longer supported. I fought Basecamp for a long time, then finally gave in. It is like algebra; you need to devote several hours of immersion to get past the initial toll gate, then, everything flows more easily. 2 Link to comment
lkraus Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 Basecamp is quite powerful with many tools and options. Which is great if you know how to use them, but if you don't, you are likely to be unhappy with result. More options mean more ways to get it wrong than to get it right. The problem is that Garmin has never produced documentation to explain exactly what Basecamp does and how their devices use the results. Imagine trying to be proficient with Photoshop without all the books and tutorials. Garmin has basically left it up to their customers to figure out how it all works. Trial and error has ruined a lot of my rides, but I gradually figured out some of the things I needed to know. Then I came across a guide (with YouTube links) on another forum that explained in detail how it all works together. After understanding that, my routes have been perfectly predictable and reliable. The guide is written for the Zumo 590/595 models, but the basics also apply to the Navigator V and VI, the Zumo 39x models and the Zumo XT. I think of it as the manual Garmin should have provided. I think I directed so many people to the other forum just for the guide that they changed their registration policies. Fortunately the author, John Heath, joined us here at BMWST. You can send a polite request with your email address to jfheath for a copy of the guide. I don't think John checks in here all that often, so be patient. He has had some people take credit for his work and wants to retain some control over the guides distribution, so he asks that it not be posted online or shared. It is also revised from time to time as he pins down details of the software. A Zumo XT version is in the works, waiting for the software bugs to settle down. In the meantime, if you have problems or questions, there is a lot of Garmin experience right here, so we can probably resolve any specific issues you might have. It helps if you tell us if you are using PC or Mac, and which GPS you use. 1 1 Link to comment
Rinkydink Posted November 27, 2021 Author Share Posted November 27, 2021 Good morning Ikraus, and thanks for the reply. I am planning an extended tour for next June and just wanted to use waypoints to stay on the backroads and avoid interstates. I am using my laptop and a Navigator VI. I’ve only spent about two hours and understand the learning curve is steep. I haven’t thrown in the towel yet. Cover me I’m going in. 😎 1 Link to comment
wbw6cos Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 I am still in the rookie catergory for Basecamp. With a little guidance from the world wide web, I am trying out my skills at creating routes, on the roads that I know the most: my neighborhood; start out small and work my way up. I have a lot to learn, though. I want to create a nice route going to Blairsville for START '22, but will most likely end up in a group ride with better routes, up and back. I will get to test out my feeble attempts for routes during the months prior to START '22. We shall see. I just need to be wary of Garmin Turns on my Nav VI. Repetition, repetition, repetition, as they say. 1 Link to comment
TEWKS Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 1 hour ago, wbw6cos said: Repetition, repetition, repetition, as they say. Believe it or not that was my undoing with Basecamp. When I first got it I was all excited to learn how the new system worked and I actually did create a nice route out to Lake George. Now for some reason, I didn’t create another one for months. That was it, the excitement was gone and my thinker didn’t want to work overtime and I gave up. 2 Link to comment
lkraus Posted November 27, 2021 Share Posted November 27, 2021 I'm glad you are starting your route planning now. You will have plenty of time to make and ride some routes in the meantime so the big tour goes well. If you have not found it already, there is a good tutorial here: https://www.newenglandriders.org/learn-basecamp/ Some of the links are broken, but there is still useful information. It will help you get set up on your laptop and get you started with the way Basecamp uses lists and folders to organize your data. YouTube also has many tutorials, though of varying quality. Random thoughts: It is a good idea to make some circuitous practice routes to familiar local destinations, like the grocery or gas station. If your first attempts don't work as expected, you won't be lost and you will not waste much time. If your screen space allows, I find it helps to turn on all the toolbars in the View menu. For a very quick route, use File>New>Route to set start and end points, then switch to the Pan tool (the hand, or "H" key). Hold the ALT key while dragging with the left mouse button to shift the route to the desired roads. A via point (must pass through, alerting) will be created when you drop it on a road. Drag the route into an intersection and a shaping (non-alerting) point will be added to the route. Drag a route to the side and put it right back if you just want to add a point to guarantee it does not change. This is much easier than creating waypoints and then trying to place them in the correct order in the route. You may need to hit the Recalculate button if the magenta line becomes straight segments. It is essential that your via and shaping points be placed on the road, and on the correct side of divided highways. Verify the placement of every point before transfering a route to the Navigator. Open the text listing of the points by double clicking the name in the left window or by right-clicking the magenta line. Check the "Center Map" box on the bottom left, which will automatically pan and zoom the map as you select each point in the list. This is a good opportunity to edit the points (right-click) to change their via/shaping (alert/non-alert) status. Use individual waypoints only for specific destinations - they become favorites on the Nav and there is no need to save random locations used only to shape the route. When you begin a route on the Nav, it will ask you to pick a starting point from all the via points on the route. It will calculate a NEW route from your present location to that choice, and only then will it use the planned route. Any via or shaping points prior to the chosen start point will be ignored. So you usually want at least some via points between start and end in the event you go off course and wish to re-start the route. The first point on the route should be down the road a bit, not your current location. Set it at a nearby intersection, or on the road leading out of town. Either you or the GPS will be confused if you ask it to go someplace you already are. Multi-day trips are best broken up into at least one route per day. A single big route is useful for initial Basecamp planning and an overview, but daily routes work better for flexibility and details. (Actually, I use Google Maps for the "big picture" view.) The Nav allows 29 via points per route, with 125 shaping points between any two via points, which is plenty for a day's ride, but probably not enough for a week. 2 1 Link to comment
Rinkydink Posted November 28, 2021 Author Share Posted November 28, 2021 Thanks for the link Ikraus that is a big help. Of course I will be carrying my Rand McNally atlas along for the ride as a backup just in case. 2 Link to comment
lkraus Posted November 29, 2021 Share Posted November 29, 2021 There is a great resource for Garmin GPS users at https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/index.php. It's worth joining for at least an occasional browse. Earlier I mentioned John Heath's guide for the 590/595, which is also relevant for the Navigator 5/6 and the Zumo 39x series. Although the full guide is obtained via email direct from John, he did post a link to his YouTube series illustrating some of the things he has learned. See Zumo 590 + 595 - What the Manuals Do not Tell. He is also working on a updated guide that explains some of the quirks(bugs?) he has found with the Zumo XT. There is more to come, but he does share some initial discoveries here: https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1464 Link to comment
Yeeha Stephen Posted December 3, 2021 Share Posted December 3, 2021 Basics... Basecamp Trng v4.pdf 2 Link to comment
Yeeha Stephen Posted December 3, 2021 Share Posted December 3, 2021 Mac... . Basecamp+Mac+Trng+v4.pdf 2 Link to comment
Rinkydink Posted December 3, 2021 Author Share Posted December 3, 2021 Very nice Yeeha. This looks like a really good thing. Link to comment
Bill Murray Posted December 4, 2021 Share Posted December 4, 2021 Rinkydink, when I first tried using Basecamp, I initially struggled with understanding how Basecamp stores and organizes your waypoint, routes, and tracks. Twice, I returned to using Garmin's Mapsource program and swore that I would never use Basecamp. When I finally understood how Basecamp works, especially with how it stores and organizes data, using Basecamp became much easier. It is really important to understand how to folders and lists are used to organize your data. I suspect that every user has an organization scheme they prefer. Mine uses separate "first-level" folders for waypoints, routes, and tracks, as well as separate folders for importing new data into my data collection and a folder where I plan my new rides before adding them permanently to my data collection. You will want to use folders and lists within these first-level folders to organize your information. Using sub-folders and lists will also help you organize your data so your map does not become so cluttered that you cannot see what you are doing. You also need to understand the difference between deleting something (a waypoint, route, or track) and removing it. When you create a waypoint, route, or track in Basecamp, copies of these can be copied or moved to multiple other folders and lists within your data collection. These are not actual copies of your waypoints, routes, or tracks, but "pointers" to those in the data collection. If you select a route or waypoint or track and delete it, you are completely removing from your entire data collection. Instead, you should use the remove option if you only intend to eliminate it from the list/folder that you are currently working in. It is also possible that you can remove waypoint, route, or track from all of your lists, but it may remain (invisible) in your data collection (invisible, until you know how to look for those types of items). If this explanation is confusing, the reference materials that others have suggested will touch on this topic. Rinkydink, feel free to DM me if you want to chat more about Basecamp data organization. Basecamp is a powerful program, but not easily understood without a lot of practice. Despite its shortcomings, it is a great tool for planning your rides in conjunction with a Garmin GPS. 1 1 Link to comment
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