I thought ABS was gonna make us safer.

[Bernie]

A big problem I think is not enough practice. A lot of riders, training or none just don’t ride enough or often enough to develop instinctive programs. In Europe you start riding at a earlier age and most young adults keep on riding due to the cost of maintaining a car, parking problems etc. 

Here in the SouthEast motorcycling is a hobby having to share time with boating, golf and other outdoor activities. So every few month they start the bike and ride for a few miles with any gear, because of the heat. You can’t get proficient with anything unless you practice frequently.

Speed is a killer, but if you fall of at 20mph with no helmet and you head hits the ground, you most likely will have a permanent problem, and any bike will do 20 mph.

[Deadboy]

Yet the accident rate is no better in Europe....I took part in a recent forum put on by the Swedish Motorcycle Federation and that is one of the more perplexing questions facing the training community. Common sense would seem to dictate that a higher bar to entry like cc limits and tiered/stricter licensing standards would be beneficial yet the data doesn't bear that out.

[Red]

On 6/16/2021 at 3:57 AM, Whip said:

From wiki.

 

Let’s try this again. 
 

Forget the article I was only using it to get the conversation started. 

 

With all the technical advances in motorcycles why are accidents and deaths  up?

 

As riders are we depending more on our bikes safety features and not practicing our skills enough?

 

Are we playing with all our new buttons and not paying attention to the road?

 

Are drivers more distracted with texting and talking on the phone?

 

Are bikes faster and  therefore more dangerous?

 

Have the demographics of riders become a more risk taking and dangerous group?

 

What is going on?

 

 

Riders are more distracted than ever.  GPS, blue tooth, ect.  It's not just the car crowd that's not paying attention.

[Tech1]

Too bad BMW made it so difficult and expensive to repair, at least on my 05.  I ended up using the RH Second Life kit to replace the brake ecu and went old school, everything on the dash works normal and the brakes feel great.

I am not spending half of the value of the bike, or more,  to get a new unit.  The rebuilds from module master is big waiting game.  I would have preferred to have it working, but no way am I spending that much.  Even the RH kit was almost as much as a module rebuild, but less wait time and no more whizzy brakes to worry about.  I can probably sell the unit to get most of my investment back.  Now if BMW had a reasonable way to upgrade without the booster, maybe I would have considered it.

[Bernie]

Maybe you should replace the bike with something that works. 

[Hosstage]

55 minutes ago, Bernie said:

Maybe you should replace the bike with something that works. 

Seems it's working just fine!

[Tech1]

On 9/1/2021 at 9:06 PM, Bernie said:

Maybe you should replace the bike with something that works. 

Believe me, I thought about it, but what would it have been worth without some kind of repair?  I may buy something newer in the next couple of years and would prefer abs, but I am sure the "whizzy" electric booster was a good part of the complication and cost.  After my experience, I know I would tell people to completely avoid the RT's with the whizzy brakes setup, I trust it more without it.

[Bernie]

I never been a fan of the whizzy brakes, one reason I waited till 2007 to buy my HexHead. But it also had the abs pump die, but I got lucky and BMW covered it under warranty. 
Technology and innovation costs money, even if it’s 20 years old. 

[Tech1]

Mine had a leak, not an electronics failure, BMW should sell the internals to rebuild it.  Module Masters has been hit or miss on getting sources for some of the internals on the whizzy brake systems.  I don't know how many understand the costs: $2870 for a new pressure modulator on the whizzy brake versions, $2078 on the gen 2 without the whizzy brakes (06).  So if I wanted to ride and not put my bike away for many months waiting to see if I could get it rebuilt, I would have needed to spend over $2800 on a motorcycle worth in the $4000 plus range, if it was in good working order.  What would I get for a trade-in, $1000?  It only had 32000 well maintained miles, including brake flushes and looks almost like new.  This is crazy.  The brake system was not built to last, and is too expensive to repair.  This and the other questionable things BMW has done that seem to be basic engineering 101 (fuel strips!, plastic female thread fuel fitting that cracks, throttle body cable guides crack, etc.), makes me wonder sometimes why I would purchase another.  Now they are doing more and more to avoid owners from doing their own repairs too.  Don't get me wrong, they do some things well, but they sure do miss some of the simple things.

Sorry, just venting.

[Rougarou]

6 hours ago, Tech1 said:

Mine had a leak, not an electronics failure, BMW should sell the internals to rebuild it.  Module Masters has been hit or miss on getting sources for some of the internals on the whizzy brake systems.  I don't know how many understand the costs: $2870 for a new pressure modulator on the whizzy brake versions, $2078 on the gen 2 without the whizzy brakes (06).  So if I wanted to ride and not put my bike away for many months waiting to see if I could get it rebuilt, I would have needed to spend over $2800 on a motorcycle worth in the $4000 plus range, if it was in good working order.  What would I get for a trade-in, $1000?  It only had 32000 well maintained miles, including brake flushes and looks almost like new.  This is crazy.  The brake system was not built to last, and is too expensive to repair.  This and the other questionable things BMW has done that seem to be basic engineering 101 (fuel strips!, plastic female thread fuel fitting that cracks, throttle body cable guides crack, etc.), makes me wonder sometimes why I would purchase another.  Now they are doing more and more to avoid owners from doing their own repairs too.  Don't get me wrong, they do some things well, but they sure do miss some of the simple things.

Sorry, just venting.

 

Ouch!!  My '06 RT (02/06 build date) has whizzy's and they are still a'whizzying at 142k.  In its life, its only had a single brake flush at 60k......guess I'm lucky (sorta-tranny's another issue)

[Bernie]

As for BMW selling repair kits for individual components. That is something no body does in any industry.

They buy from suppliers complete units and install them. If the manufacture of those items (ABS Pump) doesn't sell or isn't willing to supply repair kits or individual parts, it is out of BMW hands.

I believe it is industry standard that they only have to supply parts for 8-10 years.

BMW themselves have been very supportive of their heritage and making and selling parts for bikes that having been made for centuries.

My friend bought a Honda Pacific a few years back and decided to do it's first oil change. He drove done to the local Honda dealer.

The parts guy laughed at him and told him that Honda doesn't sell that filter any longer. The bike wasn't all that old.

My brother bought my Ford F250 truck and took it to the local dealer. The service writer refused to do any work on it, since it had 450,000+ miles on it.

 

[Tech1]

I understand the supplier issue, I work for a manufacturer and we have the same issues.  I guess I fall on the side of "right to repair".  On some of our items under contract, we request that the supplier offer some of the service parts for us to inventory and sell, although not enough of them in my opinion.  Most suppliers would prefer to sell the whole item, more profit for them and inventory cost for us, which raises the price we need to sell the part at.  I know this issue isn't BMW specific, but then they need to find a more reasonable way to make them serviceable or an otherwise excellent condition bike will go to parts sales or the scrap heap, which doesn't really affect their current bottom line.  I know that some would say that I shouldn't be able to disable the ABS and put it on the road because it isn't stock, but I say it meets the minimum on road requirements (much better than my old 80 Honda 750!).

To get back on thread, my opinion on ABS: I think it is safer and preferred.  Necessary or even mandatory, no!  We have choices for safety and everyones line in the sand of how much risk to take will be different or we wouldn't be riding motorcycles.

[9Mary7]

On 9/5/2021 at 5:43 AM, Bernie said:

Honda doesn't sell that filter any longer

Sure they do...... that dealer is an ass.